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42 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

I have no idea if Whitfield’s alleged off field activities are true or not, however Askey’s treatment of him would tend to indicate that he feels  it is. But to suggest that he himself needs to “do the decent thing” is a bit wide of the mark. 

You can have as many “good characters” in your squad as you like, but if they’re not good enough for the standard required, they are not going to improve the team.

I am not indicating that this alleged sort of behaviour should have a blind eye turned towards it but very few pro players, either old or new, could be described as “squeaky clean”

Inside the last decade we all knew of Gary Roberts’ “problems” but accepted it as he was a decent player.

To me, Whitfield is one player we have who can make a difference on the field. I see very few others who can.

 

 

Who would you leave out to accommodate Whitfield bearing in mind he is not the most disciplined player in the squad ? 

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51 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

I have no idea if Whitfield’s alleged off field activities are true or not, however Askey’s treatment of him would tend to indicate that he feels  it is. But to suggest that he himself needs to “do the decent thing” is a bit wide of the mark. 

You can have as many “good characters” in your squad as you like, but if they’re not good enough for the standard required, they are not going to improve the team.

I am not indicating that this alleged sort of behaviour should have a blind eye turned towards it but very few pro players, either old or new, could be described as “squeaky clean”

Inside the last decade we all knew of Gary Roberts’ “problems” but accepted it as he was a decent player.

To me, Whitfield is one player we have who can make a difference on the field. I see very few others who can.

 

 

This goes back to the old argument about Whitfield.

His stats are terrible... doesn’t change games coming off the bench, win ratio far better without him, goals last season game when games were already decided.

he is exciting for 10 mins and then fades.

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1 minute ago, Mario said:

Who would you leave out to accommodate Whitfield bearing in mind he is not the most disciplined player in the squad ? 

Good question.

To accommodate him I suspect you might need to change formation somewhat and play him behind Pope in something of a free role.

I am not advocating that wholesale changes should be made purely to accommodate him, but when we have a squad so devoid of game changing players, I feel that it would be stupid to throw the baby out with the bath water.

We desperately need quality players and, in my opinion, we have one in Whitfield. We certainly won’t sign another with his quality before the window closes, so why ostracise him ? 

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2 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

This goes back to the old argument about Whitfield.

His stats are terrible... doesn’t change games coming off the bench, win ratio far better without him, goals last season game when games were already decided.

he is exciting for 10 mins and then fades.

I.R. forgetting stats and ”moneyball” syndrome and his alleged poor attitude, do you think that he has ability ?

I’m not asking if you think he is worth a place, just simply is he a decent player ?

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8 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

Good question.

To accommodate him I suspect you might need to change formation somewhat and play him behind Pope in something of a free role.

I am not advocating that wholesale changes should be made purely to accommodate him, but when we have a squad so devoid of game changing players, I feel that it would be stupid to throw the baby out with the bath water.

We desperately need quality players and, in my opinion, we have one in Whitfield. We certainly won’t sign another with his quality before the window closes, so why ostracise him ? 

On the pitch he's all over the shop, remember his chasing down the keeper at Crewe that gave them their 94 minute equaliser,the ball was played through mid field he was nowhere to be seen I understand where you are coming from but if Askey doesn't think he can trust him to do his job then then thats ok by me.

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7 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

I.R. forgetting stats and ”moneyball” syndrome and his alleged poor attitude, do you think that he has ability ?

I’m not asking if you think he is worth a place, just simply is he a decent player ?

None of the other clubs he has been linked with this summer seem to think so?

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2 minutes ago, Mario said:

On the pitch he's all over the shop, remember his chasing down the keeper at Crewe that gave them their 94 minute equaliser,the ball was played through mid field he was nowhere to be seen I understand where you are coming from but if Askey doesn't think he can trust him to do his job then then thats ok by me.

On you’re point about the Crewe game, there were 9 other outfield players ! 

But regards Askey, I suspect that it’s off field activities that really cheese him off, more than his performances on it.

Not that I know of course.

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4 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

None of the other clubs he has been linked with this summer seem to think so?

 

4 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

None of the other clubs he has been linked with this summer seem to think so?

Fair comment. Football is all about opinions and we can all watch the same game and have a different point of view.

My view is that if we are talking purely footballing terms and not attitude etc, then Whitfield would be one of our better players.

But I accept, it is purely one’s own interpretation. 

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11 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

On you’re point about the Crewe game, there were 9 other outfield players ! 

But regards Askey, I suspect that it’s off field activities that really cheese him off, more than his performances on it.

Not that I know of course.

He left a huge gap that was exploited by Crewe because of his rash play,however thats water under the bridge now,on the off field activities situation I think it's 50-50 on field and off field and like you ........Not that I know of course !!!!

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20 minutes ago, RailwayRowdy said:

I.R. forgetting stats and ”moneyball” syndrome and his alleged poor attitude, do you think that he has ability ?

I’m not asking if you think he is worth a place, just simply is he a decent player ?

I think he has 10-15 mins where he comes on and can look exciting... he has an ability to score a wonder goal albeit rarely and is direct.

But I think his deficiencies of not having the stamina to last, no defensive thinking or ability and lack of calmness at the crucial moment far outweigh those positives.

Basically I think he is all noise no substance.

As I have said before, if he can find a club that wants all our attacking for short bursts and had a defensive set up so good he doesn’t need to contribute to that side of the game, he will be successful. 

We aren’t good enough to carry passengers when it comes to defensive duties.

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1 minute ago, Jacko51 said:

He has talent but he is a bit of a headless chicken.

But you can coach a “headless chicken” to perform better. You cannot coach an Anthony Griffith to become a Ray Walker.

And there lies my point. In Whitfield we have a player with ability who needs to use it better. You cannot teach players ability. 

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I have no idea if Whitfield’s alleged off field activities are true or not, however Askey’s treatment of him would tend to indicate that he feels  it is. But to suggest that he himself needs to “do the decent thing” is a bit wide of the mark. 
You can have as many “good characters” in your squad as you like, but if they’re not good enough for the standard required, they are not going to improve the team.
I am not indicating that this alleged sort of behaviour should have a blind eye turned towards it but very few pro players, either old or new, could be described as “squeaky clean”
Inside the last decade we all knew of Gary Roberts’ “problems” but accepted it as he was a decent player.
To me, Whitfield is one player we have who can make a difference on the field. I see very few others who can.
 
 

Make a difference ???? 3 goals in how many games . I can think of the Luton game where he has made a difference other than that he runs around a lot like his mate Hannant . He’s been poor

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8 minutes ago, Iron Curtain said:

I think he has 10-15 mins where he comes on and can look exciting... he has an ability to score a wonder goal albeit rarely and is direct.

But I think his deficiencies of not having the stamina to last, no defensive thinking or ability and lack of calmness at the crucial moment far outweigh those positives.

Basically I think he is all noise no substance.

As I have said before, if he can find a club that wants all our attacking for short bursts and had a defensive set up so good he doesn’t need to contribute to that side of the game, he will be successful. 

We aren’t good enough to carry passengers when it comes to defensive duties.

To some degree I see and accept your points. But for the majority of last season we had a manager whose whole approach was defensive and guess what ? We scored a paltry 39 goals !

Certainly you have to pay attention to the defensive side of the game, but it’s goals that win games not clean sheets !

There clearly has to be a balance between the two disciplines of the game, but if you don’t have creative players in your team, you are going to find it difficult to score.  That’s why we need players with something different. To me, Whitfield gives us that.

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As things stand, I wouldn’t be disappointed to see Whitfield on the bench, to be bought on with 15 - 20 mins of the game left.  Whatever the stats say, he has shown he has a bit of creativity, something which I see as lacking in the team.  Would I trust him as a starter?  No, probably not.

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8 hours ago, Mario said:

He left a huge gap that was exploited by Crewe because of his rash play,however thats water under the bridge now,on the off field activities situation I think it's 50-50 on field and off field and like you ........Not that I know of course !!!!

Harsh, if i want to be even harsher didn't that all start with Barnett and his lack of effort near their corner flag ?

The ball went from one end of the pitch to the other yet Whitfield being blamed?

I stand by what i have said previously without his winner against Chesterfield we would of been relegated that season.

Do i think he is worthy of a place in the team, not a chance. Is he a better sub than some on the books, for sure. He needs to go for both parties interests but he isn't all rotten. Unfairly painted on here by some.

These message boards are great as we all differ in opinion sometimes some people get into arguments but we are all entitled to a voice. My own slant is we are all up in arms over a bang average red card waiting to happen in Gunning yet somebody with genuine talent is berated.

Seems to be a good focal point to slag people off, Chris Lines and Anthony Grant got pelters on here yet compare those two when they were here with what we have now.

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8 hours ago, vale victory said:


Make a difference ???? 3 goals in how many games . I can think of the Luton game where he has made a difference other than that he runs around a lot like his mate Hannant . He’s been poor

His goal kept us in the football league. Personally I’d have Whitfield on the bench over most of our players. He has quality, dosent always show it but in terms of quality he is a far better option to have off the bench. Playing him where he actually plays would be a start as well. 

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I think the whole point is that he wants too much money now for the potential to deliver in the future. Bournemouth developed him for years and probably paid him something like half a million pounds during that time, (wild guess) yet they released him as not good enough. I like to watch Ben score goals but he isn't the answer to our current problems until he ups his work rate. 

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11 hours ago, Bald Eagle said:

Luke Waterfall gone Grimsby.  Good signing that

Really raised my eyebrows this. It's an unbelievable signing for Grimsby.

He played 44 times in L1 last season (53 total appearances + 6 goals).

Exactly the type of player I'd hoped we would be in for over the summer.

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Whitfield played in the team when it was at its absolute worst under Aspin and early Askey. Very difficult for any attacking player to shine in those circumstances. 

He is still quite an inexperienced player and needed better guidance, which is down to the coaching staff. The club has a lack of goals and he has the potential to be a great attacking threat. 

Instead with a whole year left on his deal, with wages we are paying each week, he gets cast off. 

Seems like a repeat of the Aspin efforts towards Worrall. 

People forget how good Whitfield was before we signed him permanently. 

 

 

 

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