NHS The sinking flagship

[geosname]

It took 50 years to detect a 2cm hole in my heart.

It took the same length of time to notice the right side of my heart was much larger than the left and atrial fibrilation...... despite many doctor and hospital visits due to my heart stopping.

When I asked for an X ray on my back I was told they don't do that anymore..... after paying for a scan privately they found 2 fractures in my spine L1 and L5... the last time I saw a doctor in the UK none of the above was in my records... after some discussion and examination I have nerve damage affecting my legs.

After urinating blood I was sent for a scan.... the doctor does not have the result of the scan I was told I would have to contact the hospital directly.

I could go on...... and on

[pjg1876]

If I didn't know you were such a grumpy old git Phil I might have taken exception.

 

I obviously don't have your experiences but often there's a simple explanation of why things operate the way things operate; it might look to you like waste and inefficiency but, for example, what if the department concerned has 'humps' of work at certain times of the day? The staff levels are needed for when the humps occur, but what do you do with them the rest of the day? My guess is to provide extra patient support, escorting them, opening doors etc. Not saying that's what it is, just offering a possible explanation.

Me a grumpy git? I did end with ‘just my own experience’.

 

I will say though that when I had my hernia just over 2 years ago, I was told by the NHS that I would have to wait at least 18 weeks for an operation. Fortunately I went private and the consultant (who also works for the NHS) told me that had I not have had the operation when I did, it would have most likely strangulated and in his own words at my post-op consultation “you would not be here today if you hadn’t had the operation so soon”. These sort of experiences do tend to cloud your judgement.

[Heatwave]

Me a grumpy git? I did end with ‘just my own experience’.

 

I will say though that when I had my hernia just over 2 years ago, I was told by the NHS that I would have to wait at least 18 weeks for an operation. Fortunately I went private and the consultant (who also works for the NHS) told me that had I not have had the operation when I did, it would have most likely strangulated and in his own words at my post-op consultation “you would not be here today if you hadn’t had the operation so soon”. These sort of experiences do tend to cloud your judgement.

 

I'm with you on that Phil, but do you think you would have had the wait if the NHS was properly funded?

 

The NHS was conceived in an age when Keynesian economics was in vogue (spend to invest) and is having to exist in an era of those of Milton Friedman (restrict public spending at all costs) - a bogus scenario as the markets so beloved of monetarists don't have a social conscience. I think economists in general are aware of the limitations of monetarism - still to be taken on board by many in the Conservative Party. Hopefully they'll see sense soon.

[philpvfc]

My experiences with the NHS has been very poor including waiting 12 months for an operation I had 2 years ago which should have been 3 months from my pre-op because of cock ups meaning I needed physio for 2 years costing the NHS quite a bit. There have been times in the past I have paid to go private because the NHS have been a shambles. Admittedly WSM is one of the worst in the country and some Hospitals are better than others but what I have found is if you are on a waiting list good luck to you. For Emergencies the NHS is brilliant, anything else it is simply not up to standard and hasn’t been since I can remember.

[pjg1876]

I'm with you on that Phil, but do you think you would have had the wait if the NHS was properly funded?

 

As an accountant, I’m probably not the best person to answer that question. Like you, I started work for a utility company pre-privatisation and stayed there for almost 40 years. During our public status, we had 11,000 employees but following a national strike during the 1980s, the company realised that this number was significantly over what was needed. Admittedly technology played a big part but standards, and therefoe costs, were ever increased following privatisation and when I left we only had around 4,000 employees. Employees were well looked after privatisation with their conditions (salary, bonuses, shares, holidays, pensions etc) and I won’t have a word said against that company. However I am sure that there are many other ex-employees who haven’t got a good word about them as the workloads definitely increased with the reduced numbers.

[RailwayRowdy]

A few years ago I was due to have an operation on my knee at the then Nth Staffs hospital. A Mr. Griffiths was due to operate.

 

After a few cancellations, I was offered to have this operation take place at the private Nuffield hospital in Clayton (but still NHS funded) as because of the delays I was outside the 18 weeks (I think it was) period and it was to be outsourced.

 

I had the operation in Clayton on a Saturday morning. The surgeon who operated was the very same Mr. Griffiths who should have done it at the Nth Staffs but had been “unavailable”

 

Discuss.

[RailwayRowdy]

As a proviso to my above comments, I will say that the actual treatment you get in the NHS is second to none.

 

13 years ago my wife was diagnosed with bowel cancer and if it had not been for the dedication and professionalism of ALL staff she would not be here today.

 

But so many balls up happen on the administration side (cancelled appointments etc) before you actually get to the treatment and I think that better organisation in itself could save millions. Whether those savings would make even more than a ripple in the overall costs incurred by the NHS is doubtful. But it would be a start.

[Warren]

A few years ago I was due to have an operation on my knee at the then Nth Staffs hospital. A Mr. Griffiths was due to operate.

 

After a few cancellations, I was offered to have this operation take place at the private Nuffield hospital in Clayton (but still NHS funded) as because of the delays I was outside the 18 weeks (I think it was) period and it was to be outsourced.

 

I had the operation in Clayton on a Saturday morning. The surgeon who operated was the very same Mr. Griffiths who should have done it at the Nth Staffs but had been “unavailable”

 

Discuss.

 

He has a NHS contract with contractual commitments. Once that is fulfilled he is allowed to be in private practice. But ... there is an argument that some consultants do not work hard enough for the NHS. Like in any walk of life I suppose, there are people working incredibly hard and people going through the motions.

[Heatwave]

He has a NHS contract with contractual commitments. Once that is fulfilled he is allowed to be in private practice. But ... there is an argument that some consultants do not work hard enough for the NHS. Like in any walk of life I suppose, there are people working incredibly hard and people going through the motions.

 

It was a trade off made right at the beginning of the NHS. Originally the plan was to ban any NHS doctors from engaging in private practice, but quite quickly the then Government realised that insufficient doctors with the right experience would work for the NHS, preferring to remain in the far more lucrative private sector. They weren't going to shut the private sector down so allowing them leeway in what they did was a compromise.

[philpvfc]

Exactly the same scenario I was in down here, also my knee. After 2 pre-ops followed by administrate errors that failed to deliver my op I paid £200 to get referred privately to have my op done through the NHS.

Answering your earlier question Heatwave regarding extra funding, any more money to the NHS will help but these problems have gone on for years and will continue to go on as half the time the left arm doesn’t know what the right arm is doing. I had a very similar wait in 1989 where I waited 2 years for an operation that I should have only waited 3 months for. The NHS is in a mess and no end of money will take it to the standard it needs to be and this is causing nurses and Doctors to be working harder and harder to try and keep up, it needs a radical change.

[geosname]

Doctors are being investigated for ghost patients.

Dentists won't do the more time consuming work even though they are contracted to do it.... they "recommend " a specialist.

Care packages are crazy... 2 people in the same house, both disabled.... care package was to include 3 visits per day to administer medication, make a drink and perhaps a micro meal.... a minimum of 4 carers 3 times a day turned up for no more than 10 minutes per visit.

My father had dementia my mother Alzheimer's, amongst other things, my father called the police to remove a strange woman in the house, my mother, the police arrived and my father threatened my mother with a knife..... police... no action taken..... I informed his doctor of the incident..... no action taken.... reported several other things to the surgery.... no action taken..... not even a visit.

I could go on..... and on....

Don't tell me the system works...... it fails in many areas.... and it's always.... lessons have be learned.... New procedures will be put in place... until the next mistake, mess, screw up.....

My father died in a care home from malnutrition.

[Regal Beagle]

https://www.manchester.ac.uk/discover/news/more-than-200-million-medication-errors-occur-in-nhs-per-year-say-researchers/

 

Manchester University estimates there are more than 200 million medication errors occuring inthe NHS which lead to up to 22,000 deaths a year.

 

But don't you dare ask questions about the NHS because the left will be on you in a flash.

[geosname]

Listeria outbreak: Health secretary orders NHS food review.

 

Warned 3 years ago apparently

[For Us All]

Any views on the incident involving Dr.Keith Wolverson at the Royal Stoke University Hospital?

[cheshirevaliant]

That's a GMC issue isn't it, rather than an NHS one?