Are our numbers falling?

[old sage]

Popeball will not attract more fans.I recently had a conversation with a Newport fan who said we must be bored silly watching Vale with the constant 60 yard long balls that come to nothing.People complain about our midfield not supplying ammunition.It would be nice to see them not bypassed occasionally.Long punts upfield ,in most cases,result in either a flicked header straight to the opposite goalie or a header straight back to the half way line.Alehouse football is not attractive.

Howjy do you seriously believe that Popey actually enjoys big punts up field to him on his own with 2-3 big rough defenders hitting him in the back?

 

I'm sure that he would much prefer as you and I would to see widemen hitting in crosses for him to attack. Sadly he isn't getting this kind of service and I bet he is as frustrated as we are watching it!

[ELDERBEZZA]

The big hoof ball isn't always necessary, as there's far more to Tom Pope's game than just bringing the ball down and hoping for the support of other players. He's a talented player and had he been blessed with more pace he'd be in a much higher league.

[Paul6754]

The big hoof ball isn't always necessary, as there's far more to Tom Pope's game than just bringing the ball down and hoping for the support of other players. He's a talented player and had he been blessed with more pace he'd be in a much higher league.

 

I couldn't agree more and for me he isn't as slow as people make out, he's no Theo Walcott but I bet he's in the same ball park as a player with a similar style eg Giroud, Peter Crouch, he's quicker than Akinfenwa!!!

 

Nothing showed his skill level better than Vale's first goal (monty's scored) vs Cheltenham and the goal he scored in the Promo season ve AFC Wimbledon away where he chased down the backpass to the goalie, jumped over the goalie and rolled 3 or 4 times and put the ball in from a very acute angle, absolutely brilliant.

 

IMHO if there weren't so many players from outside the UK playing in English football, particularly the EPL, Popey would be playing at a much higher level than Div 2.

[Danish Valiant]

Okay, reading through the posts, a lot of people blame it on the style of football. Every fan of every club, wants their team to play like Man City or Tottenham. Steam rolling over teams and winning with ease.

To be fair, I haven't seen any team playing against us, playing like that this season. Stringing passes together in midfield, is not playing like those teams. The only teams I can think of who came close, was MK Dons. By far the best team, I've seen us play this season!

 

My question is; wanting this style of football (and I'm not saying I disagree!), IF Aspin was let go, which manager would you choose, if you have free choice from any lower league manager you'd like, who could transform us to play like above, and turn the club around? I'm just curios, as I've not seen any team in League 2 play like this...

We've been out bossed by Colchester and Lincoln, in a boys v men sort of way. But I don't think we've been played out of the park, over the full 90 minutes, by any team.

Teams have had good spells, but we've had those as well.

So; just putting my question here again:

wanting this style of football (and I'm not saying I disagree!), IF Aspin was let go, which manager would you choose, if you have free choice from any lower league manager you'd like, who could transform us to play like above, and turn the club around?

[Danish Valiant]

The club don't do enough to entice supporters into paying on the gate with their high end prices. People, particularly with family or friends, cannot afford to pay £22 plus all the associated costs and then twice over

 

I cannot seriously believe that Norman still operates these high end prices...but he does,,,he is losing money hand over fist week in...week out.

 

Supporting Vale at the moment is more a leisure for the privileged few

You can say it's true, but why are you blaiming Vale for this? You want better football, better players, a better manager, better facilities and the list goes on. But who do you think will pay for this? Smurf? In your dreams!

Have you ever wondered, why the interior and the prices are so different in Poundland and Sainsburys? Many of the products are the same, but Sainsburys prices are much higher, which gives them money for nicer interiors, better products on sale, more staff, nicer locations etc etc.

And it works exactly the same in the world of football!

I've looked at every single ticket site of League 2 clubs, and our prices are bang average, for League 2! We are not the cheapest, but nor are we the most expensive! Macclesfield are the cheapest at 19 pounds, and Colchester and Yeovil, are the most expensive, with 25 pounds.

The average price across the League, comes in at 21,7 pounds. So I'll say we are bang in the middle of that. Even a bit under...

 

Lots of people say Smurf is only in it for his own profit, and other owners invest much more. And I'm by no means saying that is wrong!

But why do you think they do it? And I'm talking outside the Premier League.

They do it to go up the leagues. And what happens when you do that? You make more money. And what happens when you make more money? They get a better return, for their investment. No owner across the leagues, are running a charity! None!

And the list of clubs where owners invested heavily, and it didn't come of, so they left the club and left it in the s..., are very very very long!

The trip up is very very fun indeed, but ask the fans of those clubs, if it's as fun when the rollercoaster starts to go downhill instead...

 

Of course all owners want to make money! Speculate to accumulate. So I get Smurf could speculate and invest more, that's not what I'm saying!

But people argue, like Smurf is the only owner in football worldwide, who want's to make money from his investments. That's simply not true! By no means!

[smithie]

You can say it's true, but why are you blaiming Vale for this? You want better football, better players, a better manager, better facilities and the list goes on. But who do you think will pay for this? Smurf? In your dreams!

Have you ever wondered, why the interior and the prices are so different in Poundland and Sainsburys? Many of the products are the same, but Sainsburys prices are much higher, which gives them money for nicer interiors, better products on sale, more staff, nicer locations etc etc.

And it works exactly the same in the world of football!

I've looked at every single ticket site of League 2 clubs, and our prices are bang average, for League 2! We are not the cheapest, but nor are we the most expensive! Macclesfield are the cheapest at 19 pounds, and Colchester and Yeovil, are the most expensive, with 25 pounds.

The average price across the League, comes in at 21,7 pounds. So I'll say we are bang in the middle of that. Even a bit under...

 

You can say Smurf is only in it for his own profit, and other owners invest much more. And I'm by no means saying that is wrong!

But why do you think they do it? And I'm talking outside the Premier League.

They do it to go up the leagues. And what happens when you do that? You make more money. And what happens when you make more money? They get a better return, for their investment. No owner across the leagues, are running a charity! None!

Of course they all want to make money! Speculate to accumulate. So I get Smurf could speculate and invest more, that's not what I'm saying!

But people argue, like Smurf is the only owner in football worldwide, who want's to make money from his investments. That's simply not true! By no means!

 

I don't think any sane Vale fan would have a problem with Smurthwaite making a profit.

 

The sad and undeniable truth is that the team and club have gone very significantly backwards under his leadership. Couple that fact with his pig-headed arrogance and contempt for fans and l can definitely see why people would feel no great love for PVFC at present.

[Hagrid]

Issue with Norm isn't the lack of investment, which I think in fits and spurts he has given us at the wrong times.

 

The issue with Norm is the club isn't run very well, in terms of marketing, communication, matchday experience, longer-term strategy for the club on and off the pitch, improvements to the ground/youth academy.

 

I bang on about one owner in particular who manages to nail all the above and won't mention his name again. Just that club is proof that its less about throwing money at the club, and more about having a sustainable plan rooted in community engagement, making small improvements to the ground, and lots of initiatives designed to make the matchday experience (win or lose) a good day out for a group of people, incentivising them to return.

 

We offer literally nothing. Its turn up at 2:45, get your cup of tea, sit down and be bored, and then go home, most of us instantly forgetting the result/performance.

 

A suggestion from me; if Tommy's isn't cordoned off to solely away fans, have a 'happy hour' 2 for 1 in there when Vale win (shamelessly stolen by the club mentioned prior). Allow fans to pay a small fee to go for a drink in the Lorne Street after the game to see the MOTM presentation, speak to a couple of players etc, instead of having a bouncer guarding the stairs like access to the Robbie Williams suite is akin to the Crown Jewels.

 

Football is mostly about the game, but at this level you've got to provide more than just low-quality football to entice a group of people to come down. We don't do anything. There's no reason to come rather than watching the football, which at present is depressing and dour.

 

If I was running the club (a dreadful thought), I'd do this over the 2 christmas games:

 

1. Reduced ticket prices to £15 for the Boxing Day game. Will be a bumper crowd and a decent atmosphere. Maybe bring a kid free or something. Players not involved in the squad + Boomer are in the club shop signing shirts.

2. If you bought a ticket for Boxing Day, get a £15 ticket for the 29th. If not, normal price.

3. Open Tommy's post game for a festive happy hour. Get Rudgey to go down or something, I don't know.

4. Allow people into the Robbie Williams suite for a price. Again, happy hour/discounts with a few players making an appearance. Have a buffet on or something.

5. Bombard these people's emails and telephone numbers with the 10 game flexi they just re-introduced, maybe lob in one away game free travel on the Official Coach if they buy one? (for a decent away day, County for example)

 

We need to incentivise people more than 'come and watch some defensive football at the wrong end of the 4th tier'. It should be 'come for an affordable festive day out with your young lad/your mates and have a few drinks and meet the players. Come back on the 29th for the same'.

 

This might gain 20-30 fans. Surely thats better than the sedentary passive nature we're approaching things at the present? Keep rolling out these at opportune moments (we're a fairly financially stable club these days) and, given a slight upturn in wins and entertainment, the crowds should go up.

 

Just a bit tired of people questioning 'why aren't people coming?' when the 3000 that go these days are the ones that'll always go. We need to attract the ones that don't.

[Danish Valiant]

Issue with Norm isn't the lack of investment, which I think in fits and spurts he has given us at the wrong times.

 

The issue with Norm is the club isn't run very well, in terms of marketing, communication, matchday experience, longer-term strategy for the club on and off the pitch, improvements to the ground/youth academy.

 

I bang on about one owner in particular who manages to nail all the above and won't mention his name again. Just that club is proof that its less about throwing money at the club, and more about having a sustainable plan rooted in community engagement, making small improvements to the ground, and lots of initiatives designed to make the matchday experience (win or lose) a good day out for a group of people, incentivising them to return.

 

We offer literally nothing. Its turn up at 2:45, get your cup of tea, sit down and be bored, and then go home, most of us instantly forgetting the result/performance.

 

A suggestion from me; if Tommy's isn't cordoned off to solely away fans, have a 'happy hour' 2 for 1 in there when Vale win (shamelessly stolen by the club mentioned prior). Allow fans to pay a small fee to go for a drink in the Lorne Street after the game to see the MOTM presentation, speak to a couple of players etc, instead of having a bouncer guarding the stairs like access to the Robbie Williams suite is akin to the Crown Jewels.

 

Football is mostly about the game, but at this level you've got to provide more than just low-quality football to entice a group of people to come down. We don't do anything. There's no reason to come rather than watching the football, which at present is depressing and dour.

 

If I was running the club (a dreadful thought), I'd do this over the 2 christmas games:

 

1. Reduced ticket prices to £15 for the Boxing Day game. Will be a bumper crowd and a decent atmosphere. Maybe bring a kid free or something. Players not involved in the squad + Boomer are in the club shop signing shirts.

2. If you bought a ticket for Boxing Day, get a £15 ticket for the 29th. If not, normal price.

3. Open Tommy's post game for a festive happy hour. Get Rudgey to go down or something, I don't know.

4. Allow people into the Robbie Williams suite for a price. Again, happy hour/discounts with a few players making an appearance. Have a buffet on or something.

5. Bombard these people's emails and telephone numbers with the 10 game flexi they just re-introduced, maybe lob in one away game free travel on the Official Coach if they buy one? (for a decent away day, County for example)

 

We need to incentivise people more than 'come and watch some defensive football at the wrong end of the 4th tier'. It should be 'come for an affordable festive day out with your young lad/your mates and have a few drinks and meet the players. Come back on the 29th for the same'.

 

This might gain 20-30 fans. Surely thats better than the sedentary passive nature we're approaching things at the present? Keep rolling out these at opportune moments (we're a fairly financially stable club these days) and, given a slight upturn in wins and entertainment, the crowds should go up.

 

Just a bit tired of people questioning 'why aren't people coming?' when the 3000 that go these days are the ones that'll always go. We need to attract the ones that don't.

To say that 'lack of funds provided' isn't an issue with fans, is like saying Christmas is in May... Just read the thread about the NI guy we are after, and half the posts are about Smurf being cheap and not providing enough funds.

 

I agree about all your ideas! I even have a few myself;

 

Have a small 'fan zone' for kids outside the ground, opening an hour and a half before the game. Have small blow up football games, bouncy castle, a stall with offers on merchandise aimed at children, Boomer going around and 2 or 3 players not playing, signing autographs in the stall in the summer and the club shop in the winter. That's just for the kids. Get a few local foot trucks and ale on sale for the adults. Hold a few competitions, for a signed shirt or a few free tickets. On the last day of the season, you could offer to win next seasons season ticket for free, second one half price. That wouldn't cost the club diddly all, to give away 4 or 5 tickets to each game and 1 season ticket.

This 'Fan Zone' could be set up in the parking lot next to the club shop.

 

And here's an idea; the longest line I saw at Cambridge on the last day of the season, in all of Cambridge, was for... The ice cream van outside the ground, after the game.

Hire an ice cream van, and you could make so much money! I actually think he left because he ran out, not because the que got smaller! And he was there for over an hour!

 

Both your

[Hagrid]

To say that 'lack of funds provided' isn't an issue with fans, is like saying Christmas is in May... Just read the thread about the NI guy we are after, and half the posts are about Smurf being cheap and not providing enough funds.

 

I agree about all your ideas! I even have a few myself;

 

Have a small 'fan zone' for kids outside the ground, opening an hour and a half before the game. Have small blow up football games, bouncy castle, a stall with offers on merchandise aimed at children, Boomer going around and 2 or 3 players not playing, signing autographs in a stall in the summer and the club shop in the winter. That's just for the kids. Get a few local foot trucks and ale on sale for the adults. Hold a few competitions, for a signed shirt or a few free tickets. On the last day of the season, you could offer to win next seasons season ticket for free, second one half price. That wouldn't cost the club diddly all, to give away 4 or 5 tickets to each game and 1 season ticket.

This 'Fan Zone' could be set up in the parking lot next to the club shop.

 

And here's an idea; the longest line I saw at Cambridge on the last day of the season, in all of Cambridge, was for... The ice cream van outside the ground, after the game.

Hire an ice cream van, and you could make so much money! I actually think he left because he ran out, not because the que got smaller! And he was there for over an hour!

 

Both your

 

Problem with Norm's investments is they come and go with the mood he's in; he spent an apparent load on paying off the Bruno experiment in a convulsion of guilt, but always appoints the cheapest manager.

 

Instead of irregular, temperemental cash flows (as the January 400k appears to be), it would be far more suited (in my novice-business brain) to regularly invest smaller, consistent amounts that can be put to longer term projects such as stadium improvements, contract extensions, and fan-boosting inititiaves as we've discussed.

 

Whilst I don't doubt this Sykes is a good player, is he really going to solve the structural inadequacies this club has, or is he merely a plaster on the gaping wound?

 

Any club that gets out of this division, solidifies, and then makes a concerted effort to the Championship HAS to have this level of sustainability, fan-engagement, and a degree of self-sufficiency (though that's nigh on impossible these days).

 

Norm having fits of investment to pacify an increasingly dissatisfied and unmotivated fanbase merely kicks the problem further down the road; we're losing fans at a rapid rate.

[Danish Valiant]

Problem with Norm's investments is they come and go with the mood he's in; he spent an apparent load on paying off the Bruno experiment in a convulsion of guilt, but always appoints the cheapest manager.

 

Instead of irregular, temperemental cash flows (as the January 400k appears to be), it would be far more suited (in my novice-business brain) to regularly invest smaller, consistent amounts that can be put to longer term projects such as stadium improvements, contract extensions, and fan-boosting inititiaves as we've discussed.

 

Whilst I don't doubt this Sykes is a good player, is he really going to solve the structural inadequacies this club has, or is he merely a plaster on the gaping wound?

 

Any club that gets out of this division, solidifies, and then makes a concerted effort to the Championship HAS to have this level of sustainability, fan-engagement, and a degree of self-sufficiency (though that's nigh on impossible these days).

 

Norm having fits of investment to pacify an increasingly dissatisfied and unmotivated fanbase merely kicks the problem further down the road; we're losing fans at a rapid rate.

 

I agree again, that we have to stop trying to merely plaster over the cracks, and rebuild the wall.

Many clubs have come to this conclusion, and I’m sure Smurf will too. I just hope it’s sooner, rather than later!

But people are not easy to please! Everyone was going on about us having to BUY a striker in the summer. We did, and according to Aspin, it was damn near his dream choice!

So in that case, Smurf certainly did back his manager and delivered his no. 1 target!

But where has Miller gone? No matter what has happened, that is not Smurfs fault, I can make out that much!

So once again, people are going after Smurf, yes Smurf, for not being willing to pay for a decent striker. Well, he bought the one the manager wanted. What more can he do???

[cpade]

Make that 2007. 2nd October, 3102 v ....... Cheltenham!

Lowest on a sat since 89

[smithie]

Lowest on a sat since 89

 

Is that definite? We famously went up on June 3rd 1989 in front of 17,353.....which means we went from an abysmal crowd in the second half of a promotion season to that superb gate.

[AMF]

Whilst 4,000 plastic fans happy clapped our "Derby" victory, several thousand real football supporters (the other 8,000 who'd attend an actual Derby match)lost a little more faith in what it is to be "Port Vale".

 

I'm not surprised one bit that we've achieved our lowest Saturday attendance in 30 years after selling our soul that Tuesday night. We used to be a proud club, now we're as tin pot as everybody else in this division.

[bycars bootboy]

Whilst 4,000 plastic fans happy clapped our "Derby" victory, several thousand real football supporters (the other 8,000 who'd attend an actual Derby match)lost a little more faith in what it is to be "Port Vale".

 

I'm not surprised one bit that we've achieved our lowest Saturday attendance in 30 years after selling our soul that Tuesday night. We used to be a proud club, now we're as tin pot as everybody else in this division.

 

Yes,we used to be a proud club and it's pride that got the fans out on that Tuesday night to save face against the has-beens and I tip my hat to the fans who vociferously battled their way back to our place of worship(paddock corner).I couldn't be with you that night on principle but it hurt not to be with you all.

 

"Never fail always Vale".

[For Us All]

Lowest on a sat since 89

 

Possibly the worst weather as well?