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Brexit again...

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

Correct Mario.

The irony is that the behaviour and attitude of the more militant remainers since the referendum could end up doing far more damage than any form of brexit could do to this country.

They weren't bothered about democracy until they tried to claim that they were the democrats for about 2 weeks in September. Laughable really.

 

Literally every bit of mud they ever tried to sling can be countered with "but we voted to leave"

A failure to accept that is a rejection of democracy. 

 

We've seen a dramatic shift over the past 12 months from many remainers who have changed from denying and attempting to void the referendum result to claiming to accept it with the intention of hijacking the meaning of it (and therefore controlling brexit). This is why the labour party policy is this rubbish about negotiating a deal which they will campaign against and then have a second referendum.

 

I've asked the question many times on here but no one will ever answer it honestly. If we have a second vote and it ends up being 52% remain, what happens then? Are brexiteers expected to shake hands and concede defeat? 

Democracy applies to everyone or it applies to no one.

No.  I think a 2nd vote needs to have a minimum turnout to be valid first of all and then if the original vote is to be overturned then a certain remain majority must be achieved, say 60% for example?  So for arguments sake, if 60% of 80% of the electorate votes to reverse the decision then so be it, otherwise we carry on with the original result.

That means approximately 27M people would need to vote to reverse the decision,  approx 10M more than originally voted to leave.  To get those numbers a significant number of leavers would have to vote the other way 2nd time around.

Now why wouldnt any Brexit supporter accept that?

Edited by Nofinikea

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26 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

The question now is “ Who actually wants a deal.?”.

Well last week all the Remainers wanted to avoid a Boris no deal at all costs.

Not sure what they want this week.

Maybe they are all trying to stay in their jobs for as long as possible?

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8 minutes ago, Nofinikea said:

No.  I think a 2nd vote needs to have a minimum turnout to be valid first of all and then if the original vote is to be overturned then a certain remain majority must be achieved, say 60% for example?  So for arguments sake, if 60% of 80% of the electorate votes to reverse the decision then so be it, otherwise we carry on with the original result.

That means approximately 27M people would need to vote to reverse the decision,  approx 10M more than originally voted to leave.  To get those numbers a significant number of leavers would have to vote the other way 2nd time around.

Now why wouldnt any Brexit supporter accept that?

What happened to your hedge fund theory?🤣

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

Who is pretending it is a great new deal?

I don't support this deal although it has improved significantly on May's deal. 

So you think the mp’s should reject the deal? 

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58 minutes ago, For Us All said:

Well last week all the Remainers wanted to avoid a Boris no deal at all costs.

Not sure what they want this week.

Maybe they are all trying to stay in their jobs for as long as possible?

Incontinent Corbyn doesn’t know what he does want except to get his grubby little hands on No 10 which is looking more less likely.

His only chance for power has gone because even the other remain parties don’t want to be responsible for allowing him to run the country which would be 10 times worse than no deal.

Just need the EU to refuse an extension then it’s job done.

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9 minutes ago, Erniemossrules said:

Incontinent Corbyn doesn’t know what he does want except to get his grubby little hands on No 10 which is looking more less likely.

His only chance for power has gone because even the other remain parties don’t want to be responsible for allowing him to run the country which would be 10 times worse than no deal.Even his chum Nicola Sturgeon wants a referendum in Scotland before she backs him.

Just need the EU to refuse an extension then it’s job done.

 

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13 minutes ago, Erniemossrules said:

Just need the EU to refuse an extension then it’s job done.

Nice thought...... someone putting the mps out of our misery...... cant see it happening.

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1 hour ago, For Us All said:

Well last week all the Remainers wanted to avoid a Boris no deal at all costs.

Not sure what they want this week.

Maybe they are all trying to stay in their jobs for as long as possible?

What do you want? 

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4 hours ago, Nofinikea said:

No.  I think a 2nd vote needs to have a minimum turnout to be valid first of all and then if the original vote is to be overturned then a certain remain majority must be achieved, say 60% for example?  So for arguments sake, if 60% of 80% of the electorate votes to reverse the decision then so be it, otherwise we carry on with the original result.

That means approximately 27M people would need to vote to reverse the decision,  approx 10M more than originally voted to leave.  To get those numbers a significant number of leavers would have to vote the other way 2nd time around.

Now why wouldnt any Brexit supporter accept that?

What a load of illogical cobblers!  So you're arguing to change all the ground-rules that applied to the first referendum?  Presumably, all the people pushing for a 2nd referendum are worried that should the binary question/straight majority be put again you would lose? It's almost as illogical as the stupid argument that gets trotted out that a 2nd referendum is a show of democracy--in that case, why isn't the first referendum a perfectly legitimate show of democracy? And if it is, why then should there be another vote? QED.

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22 hours ago, Fosse69 said:

Any Labour MP backing Johnson should surely not expect to stand at the next election,

Why?  If they are REPRESENTING their electorate if they're in a leave voting constituency.  Surely that's the job they were elected to do?  A bit different in Corbyn's case.  As a life-long anti-EU (on the record if you wish to check) MP how does he square the circle of representing a constituency in Islington that overwhelmingly voted remain? I would argue that any Labour MP who's in a leave voting area and votes for the deal is being much more open & honest than Corbyn and any other Labour MPs in leave constituencies who continue to argue for remain or a second vote!

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40 minutes ago, Bycarsbill said:

Why?  If they are REPRESENTING their electorate if they're in a leave voting constituency.  Surely that's the job they were elected to do?  A bit different in Corbyn's case.  As a life-long anti-EU (on the record if you wish to check) MP how does he square the circle of representing a constituency in Islington that overwhelmingly voted remain? I would argue that any Labour MP who's in a leave voting area and votes for the deal is being much more open & honest than Corbyn and any other Labour MPs in leave constituencies who continue to argue for remain or a second vote!

So much for Smeeth and Snell voting for the deal .

They both voted for the Letwin bill which undermined the deal vote.

Both snakes using excuses to not upset Comrade Corbyn.

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13 minutes ago, Erniemossrules said:

So much for Smeeth and Snell voting for the deal .

They both voted for the Letwin bill which undermined the deal vote.

Both snakes using excuses to not upset Comrade Corbyn.

You’re angry at Corbyn for an Oliver letwin bill. You’ll be blaming him for the poll tax next. 

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1 hour ago, Bycarsbill said:

What a load of illogical cobblers!  So you're arguing to change all the ground-rules that applied to the first referendum?  Presumably, all the people pushing for a 2nd referendum are worried that should the binary question/straight majority be put again you would lose? It's almost as illogical as the stupid argument that gets trotted out that a 2nd referendum is a show of democracy--in that case, why isn't the first referendum a perfectly legitimate show of democracy? And if it is, why then should there be another vote? QED.

Are you simple?

So I suggest a system that means for the original vote to be overturned a massive majority must be gained stacking the odds massively in favour of leave winning, and you ramble on about leavers being scared of losing a 2nd vote?

Best bit is you start off by saying what an illogical load of cobblers.

Deary me, theres some slow folk on here.

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13 minutes ago, For Us All said:

Do you?

And that just sums you up. You want to criticise and complain but can’t even commit to anything of substance. All these posts and you can’t even answer if you yourself support it. You’ve taken the geo stance. Prefer to not be wrong than have a back bone. 

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1 hour ago, Andyregs said:

And that just sums you up. You want to criticise and complain but can’t even commit to anything of substance. All these posts and you can’t even answer if you yourself support it. You’ve taken the geo stance. Prefer to not be wrong than have a back bone. 

Spot on,I've decided to follow parliaments example,criticise and complain and play delaying tactics.

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