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Brexit again...

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5 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

What is the compromise?

Well,it started in the Wirral when Boris met Leo and agreed that the backstop should be scrapped.It went from there.

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8 minutes ago, For Us All said:

Well,it started in the Wirral when Boris met Leo and agreed that the backstop should be scrapped.It went from there.

Wasn’t the backstop the uk’s idea, and the eu suggested something closer to what is being agreed now. 

https://mobile.twitter.com/ByDonkeys/status/1184738823420502016

https://mobile.twitter.com/borisjohnson/status/1016373750395277313?lang=en

The farce of you all pretending this is now a great new deal, as though it isn’t 95% the same deal that may proposed and you hated. 

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The more this rumbles on and reading the comments of some posters on here and taking everything into consideration, I cant help but think that the refusal of the anti brexit group to accept a democratic vote was absolutely shameful,the damage caused is immeasurable,maybe that was the end game.

I also think that years ago the vote would have been accepted and we would have moved on warts and all.

In modern Britain however it would appear that democracy is shot and in future all decisions and votes will be contested and argued about for ever and a day and achieving nowt.

Apparently Gina Miller is already sharpening her litigation dagger,what chance does Great Britain UK Ltd have ? All because it doesn't suit the elite to leave a corrupt EU.

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Just to clarify what's being voted on.....

The deal being voted on isn't THE deal, it's the pre deal deal. The deal we have to agree before we can even talk about THE deal. The deal the EU stated they would not renegotiate after the May pre deal deal. It's not a trade deal, a free movement deal, a customs deal, a future relationship deal. It's simply a deal so we can talk about a deal.

It's similar to a prenuptial deal except it's being signed, or not, a few days before the divorce instead of the wedding.

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2 hours ago, Fosse69 said:

Of course, but they should not need telling in Johnson`s case.

It's not about Boris. 

It's not about party politics.

It's not about identity politics.

It's not about preperations for a general election.

It's a national crisis.

It's for the country as a whole.

Yeh..... right...... :rollonthefloor:

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14 hours ago, Fosse69 said:

Any Labour MP backing Johnson should surely not expect to stand at the next election,

They will be safer supporting their constituents than Jezza's mob.

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15 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

Ruth Smeeth is supporting the deal.

I had a brief,unexpected,chat with RS yesterday.She expects to upset a few people today.Her main concern was job security in Stoke.Fair play.

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12 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

I had a brief,unexpected,chat with RS yesterday.She expects to upset a few people today.Her main concern was job security in Stoke.Fair play.

Good on her Howjy.

Let's hope Snell goes the same way?

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4 hours ago, geosname said:

I maintain housework is one of the hardest jobs there is......

Is it time to clean the big house ?

Turkeys voting for Xmas?

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12 hours ago, Andyregs said:

Wasn’t the backstop the uk’s idea, and the eu suggested something closer to what is being agreed now. 

https://mobile.twitter.com/ByDonkeys/status/1184738823420502016

https://mobile.twitter.com/borisjohnson/status/1016373750395277313?lang=en

The farce of you all pretending this is now a great new deal, as though it isn’t 95% the same deal that may proposed and you hated. 

Who is pretending it is a great new deal?

I don't support this deal although it has improved significantly on May's deal. 

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11 hours ago, Mario said:

The more this rumbles on and reading the comments of some posters on here and taking everything into consideration, I cant help but think that the refusal of the anti brexit group to accept a democratic vote was absolutely shameful,the damage caused is immeasurable,maybe that was the end game.

I also think that years ago the vote would have been accepted and we would have moved on warts and all.

In modern Britain however it would appear that democracy is shot and in future all decisions and votes will be contested and argued about for ever and a day and achieving nowt.

Apparently Gina Miller is already sharpening her litigation dagger,what chance does Great Britain UK Ltd have ? All because it doesn't suit the elite to leave a corrupt EU.

Correct Mario.

The irony is that the behaviour and attitude of the more militant remainers since the referendum could end up doing far more damage than any form of brexit could do to this country.

They weren't bothered about democracy until they tried to claim that they were the democrats for about 2 weeks in September. Laughable really.

 

Literally every bit of mud they ever tried to sling can be countered with "but we voted to leave"

A failure to accept that is a rejection of democracy. 

 

We've seen a dramatic shift over the past 12 months from many remainers who have changed from denying and attempting to void the referendum result to claiming to accept it with the intention of hijacking the meaning of it (and therefore controlling brexit). This is why the labour party policy is this rubbish about negotiating a deal which they will campaign against and then have a second referendum.

 

I've asked the question many times on here but no one will ever answer it honestly. If we have a second vote and it ends up being 52% remain, what happens then? Are brexiteers expected to shake hands and concede defeat? 

Democracy applies to everyone or it applies to no one.

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

Correct Mario.

The irony is that the behaviour and attitude of the more militant remainers since the referendum could end up doing far more damage than any form of brexit could do to this country.

They weren't bothered about democracy until they tried to claim that they were the democrats for about 2 weeks in September. Laughable really.

 

Literally every bit of mud they ever tried to sling can be countered with "but we voted to leave"

A failure to accept that is a rejection of democracy. 

 

We've seen a dramatic shift over the past 12 months from many remainers who have changed from denying and attempting to void the referendum result to claiming to accept it with the intention of hijacking the meaning of it (and therefore controlling brexit). This is why the labour party policy is this rubbish about negotiating a deal which they will campaign against and then have a second referendum.

 

I've asked the question many times on here but no one will ever answer it honestly. If we have a second vote and it ends up being 52% remain, what happens then? Are brexiteers expected to shake hands and concede defeat? 

Democracy applies to everyone or it applies to no one.

No.  I think a 2nd vote needs to have a minimum turnout to be valid first of all and then if the original vote is to be overturned then a certain remain majority must be achieved, say 60% for example?  So for arguments sake, if 60% of 80% of the electorate votes to reverse the decision then so be it, otherwise we carry on with the original result.

That means approximately 27M people would need to vote to reverse the decision,  approx 10M more than originally voted to leave.  To get those numbers a significant number of leavers would have to vote the other way 2nd time around.

Now why wouldnt any Brexit supporter accept that?

Edited by Nofinikea

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26 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

The question now is “ Who actually wants a deal.?”.

Well last week all the Remainers wanted to avoid a Boris no deal at all costs.

Not sure what they want this week.

Maybe they are all trying to stay in their jobs for as long as possible?

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8 minutes ago, Nofinikea said:

No.  I think a 2nd vote needs to have a minimum turnout to be valid first of all and then if the original vote is to be overturned then a certain remain majority must be achieved, say 60% for example?  So for arguments sake, if 60% of 80% of the electorate votes to reverse the decision then so be it, otherwise we carry on with the original result.

That means approximately 27M people would need to vote to reverse the decision,  approx 10M more than originally voted to leave.  To get those numbers a significant number of leavers would have to vote the other way 2nd time around.

Now why wouldnt any Brexit supporter accept that?

What happened to your hedge fund theory?🤣

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1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

Who is pretending it is a great new deal?

I don't support this deal although it has improved significantly on May's deal. 

So you think the mp’s should reject the deal? 

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