Brexit again...

[For Us All]

26 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

Who has been in power the last 9 years?

The ones who are still trying to clean up the mess left by the Financially Illiterate Party in the previous 13 years.

You know,the ones who left a note saying "there's no money left".

[For Us All]

55 minutes ago, Jacko51 said:

For the same reason the Leavers are scared of a second referendum!

Honour the 2016 one first and then maybe in forty odd years time we might agree to another?

[Andyregs]

2 minutes ago, For Us All said:

Honour the 2016 one first and then maybe in forty odd years time we might agree to another?

You don’t want it honoured. You just want to Moan about it.

agree to another, you can’t even agree and what you chuffing want out of this one.

[Aussie Rules]

8 hours ago, Davebrad said:

he's presented a agreement that the eu have agreed to, so why are the remainers so scared of a general election?

Given my reading of UK Press I'm not sure the Remainers are running scared Dave. It seems to me there is a growing electoral malaise consequence of the inability of the Westminster 'doctors' to find a cure ergo, and in my opinion, if there was to be a GE or Referendum replay the majority of vox populi will most likely vote 'Forget it, we stay as we were'.       

[The_godfather]

1 hour ago, Aussie Rules said:

Given my reading of UK Press I'm not sure the Remainers are running scared Dave. It seems to me there is a growing electoral malaise consequence of the inability of the Westminster 'doctors' to find a cure ergo, and in my opinion, if there was to be a GE or Referendum replay the majority of vox populi will most likely vote 'Forget it, we stay as we were'.       

I'm not sure I agree Barry - electoral malaise would likely just result in less people coming out to vote rather than voting to remain.

In the main, most people would likely vote as they did previously.

Some who voted remain would vote leave because of the fatigue to "get it done" (despite the situation that it would be years)

Some who voted remain would vote leave "because of the way the EU has acted towards us" (see the red tops)

Some who voted leave would vote remain because they realise that it's just a bad idea.

Any re-run of the referendum would probably be closer than the last one.

[philpvfc]

12 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

For the same reason the Leavers are scared of a second referendum!

You’re bit like the Labour Party, cannot make your mind up!. Thought it was you who said you do not want another referendum.

personally, I think it would be a disaster if there is another referendum as if we voted out we will be no further on with Brexit than we are now and if we voted to remain the conflict will never end and it will create a lot of anger that will never be rectified.

but to have another referendum it will have to be agreed through parliament for which it has already been voted out, the situation we now have is;

- Conservatives want to sort out a deal and leave the EU as close to what people voted for

-Liberals don’t want a Referendum but May vote for one, they want to reverse any Brexit and remain

- Labour still haven’t made their minds up

If Labour go down the route of pushing for a second Referendum then they will need the majority of MPs to vote for this in Parliament but at the moment they will never get the majority as pretty well all the Tories will not vote, DUP won’t vote for it and a lot of Labour MPs will not or abstain. So for a 2nd Referendum to happen there will have to be a general election first and it is looking like the same if we are to have a deal agreed through parliament.

So in short, it is looking whatever the outcome we will be having a general election first.

[Jacko51]

18 minutes ago, philpvfc said:

You’re bit like the Labour Party, cannot make your mind up!. Thought it was you who said you do not want another referendum  

I don’t and I can’t see how my post that you quoted suggests that I do???

[Howjy04]

Strange how some MPs want to scrutinise the deal having already stated they would vote against it before scrutiny.Vankers.

[For Us All]

14 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

The only MPs who will be betraying their constituents are those who don't give sufficient thought to the most important decision this Parliament will make this century. 

According to your Brexit map there will be plenty of Remainer MP's joining the dole queue.The country's painted blue apart from London,Scotland and N.Ireland.

 

[Fosse69]

13 hours ago, For Us All said:

The ones who are still trying to clean up the mess left by the Financially Illiterate Party in the previous 13 years.

You know,the ones who left a note saying "there's no money left".

The old chancellor jokes are the best and  Brown causing the US banking disaster, but don't mention the £1000Billion extra debt ramped up by the Eton chaps.

[Fosse69]

34 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

Strange how some MPs want to scrutinise the deal having already stated they would vote against it before scrutiny.Vankers.

No more strange than MPs who will vote for it without reading it, I would not  trust Johnson with a stray dog never mind the fate of the nation.

[For Us All]

14 hours ago, Davebrad said:

we had a referendum...

Yes,and if the Remainers had accepted defeat we wouldn't be in this mess.

In fact based on Berkoff law,where you can't vote on the same proposal twice,we wouldn't be able to have a second referendum?

[Howjy04]

7 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

No more strange than MPs who will vote for it without reading it, I would not  trust Johnson with a stray dog never mind the fate of the nation.

It’s ,as everyone knows,another stalling tactic by the losers.The lawyers ,for them ,would have been over this deal like a cheap suit as soon as it became available.I suggest that all that needs to be known is known.

[Davebrad]

14 minutes ago, Nofinikea said:

The issue here isnt the need for due scrutiny.  The issue is that the Tories got an extension in spring and then did nothing until last week.  Nobody else was in government so nobody else can do this.  

The deal Boris has negotiated seems to have some pretty bad points in it for the every day working man.  This needs due scrutiny and amendments, which takes time. 

So if it was me, would I vote for it if pushed and rushed without being able to scrutinise?  Most definitely not, get the extension so we can do this properly.

Would I vote for it after due scrutiny and amendments? I dont know because it all depends on the detail but there is a better chance that I would.

Saying they will vote it down now regardless is not saying they will vote it down if due process is actually given.

It's not difficult to understand that due to having a PM and cabinet in place that is proven untrustworthy, allowing them to push through Bill's without proper scrutiny is too dangerous and thankfully the house recognises that.  This deal isnt designed to be accepted, it was designed to trigger a no deal exit, which the house has blocked and continues to have to focus on because Johnson is a lieing tosser.

Of course you all know that, even though you pretend you dont.

the tories got? no were forced to ask for a extension because parliament could not stop bickering over petty partisan issues... and has its a dead parliament very little can get done. Jeremy cries and moans about everything and his dog, but hasn't got the balls to simply call a election, but there again he's got mac the knife waiting for him to fail so he can lead the red army...

[Fosse69]

On 21/10/2019 at 10:27, Jacko51 said:

Keep up at the back there - the Guardian hasn’t been a broadsheet for years, Barry!!

Physically correct, but as with the Independent which is now  digital, the Guardian is  still referred to as a broadsheet paper. The term being used similar to a collective noun to distinguish the group against the cut down papers more handy for reading in toilets. In my opinion 😀