onevalefan.co.uk Present Past Specials About Forum
Jump to content
onevalefan.co.uk forum

Advert


Advert


Brexit again...


Davebrad

Recommended Posts

Advert

3 minutes ago, geosname said:

If the default position of a second referendum was the result of the first referendum I wouldn't argue with a 66.66% majority on the same question being asked.

Leave

Or

Remain

But that doesn't solve the biggest problem--which is TRUST! You and other people arguing for a second vote are missing the biggest issue of al; what is the point of keep offering a referendum when the vast majority of people would argue that it's not going to be honoured?  I would have loved the first referendum result to have gone to the remain vote--the way I voted--but it didn't.  And despite my initial disappointment, I have to repeat that democracy cannot be seen to be carried out if the will of the majority is ignored!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Mario said:

Corbyn said on Sky they wont support it and I think, not sure so did the Lib Dem spokesman,it's obvious Sturgeon wont support it what ever the result.

They can't afford to openly support it.... the big question for me is can they afford to bring it down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Bycarsbill said:

But that doesn't solve the biggest problem--which is TRUST! You and other people arguing for a second vote are missing the biggest issue of al; what is the point of keep offering a referendum when the vast majority of people would argue that it's not going to be honoured?  I would have loved the first referendum result to have gone to the remain vote--the way I voted--but it didn't.  And despite my initial disappointment, I have to repeat that democracy cannot be seen to be carried out if the will of the majority is ignored!

I'm not arguing for a second vote but if that's what people forced into it's about the only thing that makes sense.

Fosse is saying the default position if the threshold isn't reached should be remain.

I'm saying if it isn't reached we should leave as per the first referendum decision...... using the original question.

My personal opinion is the first result should be honoured before a second referendum is contemplated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, whotobeakiller said:
1 hour ago, geosname said:

Junker says no extension.... we have a deal so no need for prolongation.

That's screwed the Benn/surrender act.

Farage is moaning about it.

You really couldn't make this crap up

junker's never liked us cause we kept shooting his planes down...🤣

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, Bycarsbill said:

Firstly, I agree it was originally an idea of David Cameron's but if 82% of MPs voted to hold a referendum, it can hardly be said that it was ONLY Cameron who is to blame! Secondly, how has the "vote been honoured" as you put it?  I'm assuming you mean the referendum and if so, by no stretch of the imagination can you possibly claim that it has been honoured.  If it had, we would have left on March 29th! Thirdly, you've dodged the most important questions of all: a) what 2 questions would you ask on this new "peoples' vote"? Referenda usually have just a binary format i.e. 2 questions only. b) why are you suddenly adding-in this arbitrary new 66.6% threshold? And most importantly of all, why should anyone believe that a new vote will be honoured after the original one so clearly hasn't?!!

Not to have been honoured would have been not to seek a deal via the Article 50 system,  2 questions as before Leave or Remain, i.e. the latest offer or our current status, Belief in politicians is a matter of taste,  a PM sacked for lying by a newspaper is not my taste.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, geosname said:

They voted on the information the people in the know gave them..... if the people in the know are ignorant how is that the voters fault.

Well remainers voted based on what they knew, the status quo. What you suggest is an abdication of responsibility for what you vote for. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Andyregs said:

Well remainers voted based on what they knew, the status quo. What you suggest is an abdication of responsibility for what you vote for. 

People voted on the information they were given. A percentage of that information were forecasts that were incorrect. A huge percentage of relevant information wasn't given because the people in the know didn't actually know.

If a party promises to invest 10 billion in the NHS before an election but doesn't deliver is it the electorates fault for voting for them?..... after the referendum  both major parties stood an a platform of honouring the referendum result.... didn't they know of any problems at the time?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 29/09/2019 at 18:50, Nofinikea said:

I am well aware what a hedge fund is and how it works and I am also aware that many of Boris's mates have bet millions on the pound tumbling.  The way to guarantee that is to crash out of the EU on 31st October without a deal.

Now, seeing as coming out of the EU is such a great thing and will benefit is all (according to you and a few others on here), why do you suppose that the markets are expecting the pound to nose dive upon such an occurrence?  I mean, from what you tell us, the pound should sky rocket shouldn't it, making us all better off?  Care to explain how the pound devaluing (which it already significantly has since the vote) is good for us all?  I know the few exports we still have should be better off, of course they often import first in there supply chain so its negated but how is the bloke in Asda better off when his pound buys less?

Also, it's not my theory.  It's the theory of people much cleverer than me and infinitely more intelligent than you.

So this was a complete load of rubbish then?

Those infinitely clever people weren't so clever after all. Stay tuned if you want a brexit prediction that actually comes true (You won't like it, because it was from me and it was absolutely spot on).

On 01/09/2019 at 10:02, Jacko51 said:

Just suppose this is a cunning plan by Bojo and Co to concentrate the minds of the EU because they will see no deal is inevitable if they don't do something.  Just suppose the EU bends a bit and we actually end up with a deal.  What do you think will be the reaction of FUA, RB and Howjy:

a) They will applaud Boris for being a genius;

b) They will say they never wanted No Deal anyway despite banging on about it being the best thing since sliced bread,

c) They will spontaneously combust?

Where do you stand on this post now out of interest Jacko? 

And out of interest which option do you think will be correct? A B or C?

On 05/09/2019 at 22:09, Jacko51 said:

So why did Johnson tell us it could happen?  Why did he say the chances of no deal were a million to one?

Maybe he was negotiating?

Maybe, like brexiteers have said all along, you need all of your cards on the table in a negotiation.

 

 

And here's what I posted in August, when Johnson tried to prorogue parliament. Whilst prominent remainers, the media and even a couple of defeated Tory leadership hopefulls were telling us that there was no chance that the EU would give any concessions on the backstop.

Whilst they were telling us that Johnson was riding roughshod over our democracy to force no deal through.

On 29/08/2019 at 06:32, Regal Beagle said:

I actually believe he has done it to try and get a deal without the backstop through parliament so I'm not particularly excited about it. I'm indifferent really.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, geosname said:

Junker has said no extension......

If the deal on the table is not accepted what's the alternative?

They could revoke article 50...... good luck trying to explain that to the public..... and go for a general election.

Would that blow Labour's stance out of the water?

Juncker over ruled by Tusk, extension situation still available

Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, Regal Beagle said:

Leavers voted based on what they knew, the status quo.

And three of the regular posters have now said leaders voted for something they didn’t understand or know enough about. 

1 hour ago, geosname said:

People voted on the information they were given. A percentage of that information were forecasts that were incorrect. A huge percentage of relevant information wasn't given because the people in the know didn't actually know.

If a party promises to invest 10 billion in the NHS before an election but doesn't deliver is it the electorates fault for voting for them?..... after the referendum  both major parties stood an a platform of honouring the referendum result.... didn't they know of any problems at the time?

It was clear to anyone who thought long enough about it, that voting leave would be a vote in the dark.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Andyregs said:

And three of the regular posters have now said leaders voted for something they didn’t understand or know enough about. 

It was clear to anyone who thought long enough about it, that voting leave would be a vote in the dark.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning–Kruger_effect

First of all, I'm not quite sure you've interpreted the posts correctly there, and I think it's quite clear what they were and were not saying, but I'll let them explain their own posts.

What is your point exactly? If it's just an observation, fair enough, I don't fully agree but I understand and will agree up to a point. If you are trying to somehow delegitimize the result then how far back do we go? Can we say the same about the 1975 referendum?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Reporting Posts and other information

    Rules - This forum is moderated but the admin team don't read everything. Don't assume we'll spot rule breaking and alert us by reporting content. Logged in users can hover over the post and click the orange button. Guests can contact us here. If you don't get on with another user you can "ignore" them. Click this link, type in their username and click save. Please check with the admin team if you wish to sell/auction any items. We're happy to support good causes but check first.

    Use - This forum may not be suitable for all as it may contain words or phrases not considered appropriate for some. You are personally responsible and potentially liable for the contents of your posting and could face legal action should it contain content of a defamatory or other illegal nature. Every message posted leaves a traceable IP number. Please do not reveal any personal information about yourself or anyone else (for example: phone number, address or email address). This forum is not in any way affiliated with Port Vale FC. OVF reserve the right to edit, delete, move or close any thread for any reason. If you spot an offensive post please report it to the admin team (instructions are above).

    Adverts - This site occasionally a) has adverts and sponsored features about gambling b) accepts sponsored posts from third parties. If you require help and advice on gambling read these links: Information on protecting young people | Addiction help from gambleaware.co.uk
  • Friends of OVF

×
×
  • Create New...