Brexit again...

[Fosse69]

12 hours ago, Mario said:

Lady Nugee playing a blinder on Question Time..........She says IF Labour win a general election she would go back to the EU try and get a better deal, have a referendum where remain is an option and then she would campaign to remain against her own deal.

This is bloody confusing.

Not only are Boris and Rees Mogg of their rockers but the opposition have their share of basket cases and Dianne Abbott hasn't even come to the oche yet.

Unbelievable.

Straight forward, you get the best deal possible and then let the people who started it  say what they now want.  Don't leave important things to politicians.

[Fosse69]

13 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

With respect I disagree, the option was to agree a deal or to revoke (which can be temporary apparently), the default being no deal (a ridiculous situation). Luckily I am retired and do not need to sell anything, that will be up to the Rebel Alliance to attempt a different deal, same deal or revoke via a referendum. Probably the simple part, returning the country to normal if ever is the hard part, 

 

26 minutes ago, geosname said:

With respect fosse..... it could have been written by Donald duck..... 400+ in the know MPs voted it through into law which gave all 600+ an option to agree a deal or leave without one..... they didn't agree a deal..... now they are saying we can't leave without one.

That leaves one action to be taken...... remain.

After promising to honour the result of the referendum the politicians faff about for over 3 years to deliver, by their own hand...... remain?

Good luck trying to sell that to the voters and the 17,000,000+ who voted to leave and the growing number who are angry about the arsing about with bugger all result..... either way.

 

[Howjy04]

Supreme Court hearing on Sept 17 re Parliament closure.

Conference dates.

TUC 8-11 Sept.

Lib Dems 14-17 Sept

Chicken Party 21-25

Tories 29 Sept- 2 Oct.

Green Party 4-6 Oct.

Is Gina Miller paying for these court proceedings? More money than sense springs to mind.

You couldn’t make it up.

[Howjy04]

22 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

Straight forward, you get the best deal possible and then let the people who started it  say what they now want.  Don't leave important things to politicians.

What’s straightforward about getting a good deal then promoting Remain.She is deluded,Fosse.

Picture the 4 maIn front benchers if Labour get in.

Chicken,McDonell,Abbott and Thornberry.

You couldn’t make it up.

[Fosse69]

9 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

Supreme Court hearing on Sept 17 re Parliament closure.

Conference dates.

TUC 8-11 Sept.

Lib Dems 14-17 Sept

Chicken Party 21-25

Tories 29 Sept- 2 Oct.

Green Party 4-6 Oct.

Is Gina Miller paying for these court proceedings? More money than sense springs to mind.

You couldn’t make it up.

Wasting police time, policewoman falling asleep, didn't make it up about the PM

[geosname]

29 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

 

 

I was referring to the political parties making the sales pitch mate...... apparently us old farts are not fit for purpose anyway

[Fosse69]

2 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

What’s straightforward about getting a good deal then promoting Remain.She is deluded,Fosse.

Picture the 4 maIn front benchers if Labour get in.

Chicken,McDonell,Abbott and Thornberry.

You couldn’t make it up.

The people voted in a referendum, surely they should vote on what reality is, if you were offered another car would you take it instead of your better one?

[Fosse69]

5 minutes ago, geosname said:

I was referring to the political parties making the sales pitch mate...... apparently us old farts are not fit for purpose anyway

Sorry, it will be a difficult job but it has to be done.

[Howjy04]

I keep hearing that there is no mandate to leave without a deal.Can someone explain where the mandate is to Remain in the EU?

[Fosse69]

16 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

I keep hearing that there is no mandate to leave without a deal.Can someone explain where the mandate is to Remain in the EU?

The referendum was advisory, politicians decide, it looks as if the chicken is ruling the roost.

[ginge]

58 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

I keep hearing that there is no mandate to leave without a deal.Can someone explain where the mandate is to Remain in the EU?

16 million voted to remain in the EU. Nobody voted to leave without a deal because during the referendum that option wasn't mentioned!

[Jacko51]

32 minutes ago, Fosse69 said:

The referendum was advisory, politicians decide, it looks as if the chicken is ruling the roost.

This is the whole problem with the referendum in the first place.  As I have said all along, the referendum was a crazy idea on an issue that none of us knew enough about.  Who mentioned the Irish border during the campaign?  Who understood the consequences of it if they did?  Who understood WTO rules and their effects on farmers?  Who knew that the majority of immigrants to this country come from outside the EU so leaving would make no difference to them?  Who knew all sorts of other stuff which has only become evident since the referendum?

We voted to leave so that's what we have got to do.  The referendum advised the government to leave the EU and, because of what Cameron and Co had said, effectively manadated them to do so.  But Parliament has to do it in a way that will damage this country as little as possible.  The problem is that the extreme leavers in Parliament like the ERG have prevented the then Prime Minister from achieving a deal.  They were helped by the Labour Party and other opposition groups.  The ex PM never opened herself to cross party involvement in the deal discussions.

The consequences of all of this is that MPs are so set in their opinions that few are prepared to consider alternatives to their fixed and immovable views.  And we now have a PM who has always wanted a soft Brexit and promised as much in the campaign but who is now being driven by extremists into quite the opposite outcome.

And we also have leavers like Farage, Tice and Co who said we could have something like a Norway deal saying they don't want that but we should just jump instead. 

In years to come historians will look back on this period in our history and wonder what infection spread across this country and turned us all into idiots.

[Howjy04]

25 minutes ago, ginge said:

16 million voted to remain in the EU. Nobody voted to leave without a deal because during the referendum that option wasn't mentioned!

I didn’t see the small print on the voting slip that said ‘If you vote Leave,tough’.

 

[geosname]

27 minutes ago, ginge said:

16 million voted to remain in the EU. Nobody voted to leave without a deal because during the referendum that option wasn't mentioned!

If you disreguarded a result because political campaigners didn't tell the voters something you would be voting twice a week.

[For Us All]

16 hours ago, Jacko51 said:

Agreed.  Which highlights the stupidity of rejecting the only deal which was on the table.

Personally I can see no point in a general election prior to Brexit because it will decide nothing.  If Johnson stands on a no deal platform it will prove him to be one of the biggest hypocrites on the planet after all he's said in the past.  If he promises a deal and doesn't get it, it will show he's incompetent.  If I want to vote for Brexit with a deal how do I do it?  If I want to vote for an anti-Stalinist party where the cult of leader plays no part and members don't disappear because the disagree with the leader, who do I vote for?

Surely there has to be an option on the ballot paper which says "None of these stupid buggers thank you very much."

If you had taken into account what the leader of the opposition had said in the past you'd also wonder how he was able to even become a leader.Unless of course...............?