Brexit again...

[geosname]

50 minutes ago, Paul6754 said:

One reason why the UK joined the EU in the first place was due to the declining UK economy post war linked with the disappearing British Empire. The government of the day realized Britain couldn't compete on it's own so to remain strong and influential it had to form alliances, treaties etc with other countries.

Nothing has changed 50 years later other than the UK is no longer the manufacturing power house it used to be coupled with the rise of low wage manufacturing economies of China and India. The historical  precedent suggests Britain will find it tough on it's own to compete economically.

 

I agree mate, with an added bit..... brexit has caused a conundrem within an enigma for politics.... offering the people the choice followed by stating the choice will be honoured leaves politicians between a rock and a very hard place... dammed if they do.... dammed if they don't. 

[Regal Beagle]

21 hours ago, ginge said:

Real...not imaginary 

Well being goverened by the UK is pretty real for starters.

[ginge]

1 hour ago, Regal Beagle said:

Well being goverened by the UK is pretty real for starters.

And that makes yours and mine and every other everyday person's life better how?

More cuts to public services? Death penalty introduction? Lgbt rights taken away? Women's abortion rights reduced? ..... because the new cabinet have some pretty strong right wing views, I'd rather they have less power.

[geosname]

4 hours ago, ginge said:

And that makes yours and mine and every other everyday person's life better how?

More cuts to public services? Death penalty introduction? Lgbt rights taken away? Women's abortion rights reduced? ..... because the new cabinet have some pretty strong right wing views, I'd rather they have less power.

Now yòur getting into a whole new area...... I agree THEY (all politicians) should have less power... so should THE LAW..... but I suspect we have different reasons for saying it.

[Aussie Rules]

6 hours ago, Regal Beagle said:

Well being goverened by the UK is pretty real for starters.

Behave theesen RB, the current lot struggle to find the Dispatch Box 😉

[geosname]

8 hours ago, ginge said:

And that makes yours and mine and every other everyday person's life better how?

More cuts to public services? Death penalty introduction? Lgbt rights taken away? Women's abortion rights reduced? ..... because the new cabinet have some pretty strong right wing views, I'd rather they have less power.

I would start by making every law and official policy applicable to everyone... no exceptions, no special groups, no get outs.... everyone equal under the law.

Secondly..... if a mother is considered a mother at the point of conception and a father is not a father until birth..... it's fundamentally flawed. 

Life should mean life.... until death.... no parole.... and should be a mandatory sentence for specific crimes.

Seatbelt and crash hat law should be scrapped..... it should be a strong advice not a law.

But like I said this is a whole different subject.

[geosname]

3 hours ago, Aussie Rules said:

Behave theesen RB, the current lot struggle to find the Dispatch Box 😉

I thought that's where they hid the bodies Barry 

[TheSage]

Clearly three is a valid viewpoint that being able to make all our own decisions in London is better than pooling our sovereignty and  joining in the EU. Different politicians from all sides of the spectrum have argued this case for years. 

However, as ginge I think has pointed out a few times, it's very hard (if not impossible) to give examples of where the EU has imposed laws on us that have been harmful and adversely affected us and our families. It's usually only when those in the Establishment haven't got their own way that the press on the right kick up a fuss, chiefly about legal matters. But who is the best arbiter of justice? The government or an independent judiciary. Do you recall the disgraceful Daily Mail headlines about the Supreme Court being traitors and enemies of the people?

As a UK citizen with a family I can only say how pleased I've been with a number of EU initiatives. The introduction of paternity leave, the maximum working hours directive, higher environmental standards, cheaper travel, paid holiday leave for 2 million workers who used only to get odd Bank Holidays off before. These have been good things.

I read an article last week in which an academic at Oxford University was suggesting that the reason why many folk in this country are anti-Europe is down to the media and press. His theory was that almost all his colleagues across the world think Brexit is daft, an act of self harm, and they can't fathom why we'd want to go down this path. But of course they don't see the British press and media. Interesting thoughts for me.

[Howjy04]

12 hours ago, ginge said:

And that makes yours and mine and every other everyday person's life better how?

More cuts to public services? Death penalty introduction? Lgbt rights taken away? Women's abortion rights reduced? ..... because the new cabinet have some pretty strong right wing views, I'd rather they have less power.

Opinions aren’t laws.

[ginge]

3 hours ago, Howjy04 said:

Opinions aren’t laws.

So you don't mind Jeremy Corbyn's views on defence then if he ever became the pm, as it's just an opinion? 

[jimbo57]

21 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

One reason why the UK joined the EU in the first place was due to the declining UK economy post war linked with the disappearing British Empire. The government of the day realized Britain couldn't compete on it's own so to remain strong and influential it had to form alliances, treaties etc with other countries.

Nothing has changed 50 years later other than the UK is no longer the manufacturing power house it used to be coupled with the rise of low wage manufacturing economies of China and India. The historical  precedent suggests Britain will find it tough on it's own to compete economically.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

21 hours ago, Paul6754 said:

Not forgetting of course the billions of pounds of debt incurred by the UK  in fighting Germany, twice, last century,

to ensure Europe's freedom.

 

[Howjy04]

7 minutes ago, ginge said:

So you don't mind Jeremy Corbyn's views on defence then if he ever became the pm, as it's just an opinion? 

The difference is Corbyn will never be PM.

[geosname]

10 minutes ago, ginge said:

So you don't mind Jeremy Corbyn's views on defence then if he ever became the pm, as it's just an opinion? 

Becoming the PM doesn't make it law, it has to get through the house...... ask May.

[geosname]

3 minutes ago, Howjy04 said:

The difference is Corbyn will never be PM.

I don't think he will either...... I don't think Labour could win a GE right now and I think he will stand down before one is called.

I could be wrong of course...... it doesn't happen often but it could 

[mr.hobblesworth]

It's funny how on one hand people state that Corbyn is useless and can never win an election but on the other hand go on about how dangerous he is and how it was important to choose the tory candidate who can beat him. He's not going anywhere (except to Number 10, hopefully by the end of the year).