Brexit again...

[Fosse69]

'Brexiteer' Jezza wants to remain in the customs union and continue with free movement.

You couldn't make it up?

Don't need to make it up, we would still have left the EU, worse off I know, but there is no way of avoiding that.

[For Us All]

The vote yesterday was for the Brexit deal only with many Tory MPs voting against it, but I would be very surprised if those same Tory MPs support a no confidence vote against their own leader to trigger a general election.

 

Yes it was but after such a resounding defeat is she the right person to continue in power?She should have known that her Brexit deal didn't have a cat in hells chance of getting through,so to me her judgement is in question for putting it forward in the first place.

Nothing will be sorted until everybody comes together and stops playing party politics.

[Fosse69]

Yes it was but after such a resounding defeat is she the right person to continue in power?She should have known that her Brexit deal didn't have a cat in hells chance of getting through,so to me her judgement is in question for putting it forward in the first place.

Nothing will be sorted until everybody comes together and stops playing party politics.

It was Cameron who opened the can of worms, there is no agreement on what Brexit is, maybe time to ask the electorate again?

[VantaaVale]

It was Cameron who opened the can of worms, there is no agreement on what Brexit is, maybe time to ask the electorate again?

 

I think it probably is right, but my concern is that campaigners again will invent reasons to vote one way or the other.

 

Having said that I think people in general now know more about the consequences of Brexit than they did three years ago and may be able to filter out the nonsense claims that were made last time around.

 

Having watched Parliament TV over the past week of debate or so, firstly it is no wonder no progress has been made. The "debates" are frankly ridiculous, with the same questions and observations being made over and over again by different politicians. But it seems to me that politicians are engineering a way to stop Brexit altogether.

[Fosse69]

I think it probably is right, but my concern is that campaigners again will invent reasons to vote one way or the other.

 

Having said that I think people in general now know more about the consequences of Brexit than they did three years ago and may be able to filter out the nonsense claims that were made last time around.

 

Having watched Parliament TV over the past week of debate or so, firstly it is no wonder no progress has been made. The "debates" are frankly ridiculous, with the same questions and observations being made over and over again by different politicians. But it seems to me that politicians are engineering a way to stop Brexit altogether.

I assume stopping Brexit is the conclusion of no agreement on what it is, or putting it on hold until they make their minds up.

[geosname]

Isn't a 2nd referendum/ vote on the final deal (with remain an option) a credible option? Also, when May faced the initial no confidence, didn't she pledge to stand down before the next election?

 

The election that has to be, not one called for. If I remember correctly..... there can not be another leadership challenge for a while so she would have to resign and leave her party leaderless heading into a general election..... not likely... her resignation may not be accepted.

To get a referendum on the final deal there has to be a deal.... what if it was a vote on the final deal or no deal?

The only people calling for a second in or out referendum are the no hopers... liberals who see it as a vote winner and a seat grab for a coalition... SNP with no hope of control etc.

The main parties are shying away from alienating 50% of the voters... a lot of labour voters voted leave... hung parliament?.... I doubt the Tories would call for one.

So at best a hung parliament with no mandate after a general election.... at worst a small majority for one party with little hope of getting an agreement on any deal negotiated through the next house vote... back to square one... another vote of no confidence... another general election.... more leadership changes... and round and round we go.

I doubt jezza would survive winning a general but losing on the deal. May won't, she's a busted flush but she may well survive the no confidence vote... the Tories will get rid when it suits them.

The only people who will offer a referendum in a general election are the ones who have nothing to lose.

[geosname]

I assume stopping Brexit is the conclusion of no agreement on what it is, or putting it on hold until they make their minds up.

 

Brexit won't stop because there is no deal..... article 50 has to be rescinded to stop it and the EU has to agree... otherwise no deal goes through.

[geosname]

I think the Tories have said they won't rescind article 50

[geosname]

It was Cameron who opened the can of worms, there is no agreement on what Brexit is, maybe time to ask the electorate again?

 

It would take months for a second referendum.... weeks for a general election.... we have until March.

Don't forget the vote was on the deal negotiated..... not on whether we should leave the EU... it's not a victory for remainers or leavers... it's just a defeat for the deal on offer.

[Heatwave]

It would take months for a second referendum.... weeks for a general election.... we have until March.

Don't forget the vote was on the deal negotiated..... not on whether we should leave the EU... it's not a victory for remainers or leavers... it's just a defeat for the deal on offer.

 

We could change the A50 date unilaterally and the EU wouldn't object, as long as the UK looked likely to resolve their position shortly thereafter. In my opinion the only way to do that is BrexitRef2.

[geosname]

We could change the A50 date unilaterally and the EU wouldn't object, as long as the UK looked likely to resolve their position shortly thereafter. In my opinion the only way to do that is BrexitRef2.

 

Only a lunatic would alienate 50% of the electorate by calling for a 2nd referendum...

The Tories won't so a general election will be needed and someone (jezza) would have to state it in his manifesto... if he sees that as a winner for a general election he may just be that lunatic.

The no hope parties may well do that but that will reduce the votes of the main parties... who would they form a coalition with?... if a second referendum is a condition of a power share it won't be the Tories..... and if Labour don't make it a manifesto promise it won't be them either.

[geosname]

I think if an election is called and Labour offers a second referendum as a manifesto pledge the fireworks will really start.

[man in the pub]

Has he gone yet, wrong thread but maybe not.

[Fosse69]

I think the Tories have said they won't rescind article 50

Parliament would have to.

[For Us All]

The election that has to be, not one called for. If I remember correctly..... there can not be another leadership challenge for a while so she would have to resign and leave her party leaderless heading into a general election..... not likely... her resignation may not be accepted.

To get a referendum on the final deal there has to be a deal.... what if it was a vote on the final deal or no deal?

The only people calling for a second in or out referendum are the no hopers... liberals who see it as a vote winner and a seat grab for a coalition... SNP with no hope of control etc.

The main parties are shying away from alienating 50% of the voters... a lot of labour voters voted leave... hung parliament?.... I doubt the Tories would call for one.

So at best a hung parliament with no mandate after a general election.... at worst a small majority for one party with little hope of getting an agreement on any deal negotiated through the next house vote... back to square one... another vote of no confidence... another general election.... more leadership changes... and round and round we go.

I doubt jezza would survive winning a general but losing on the deal. May won't, she's a busted flush but she may well survive the no confidence vote... the Tories will get rid when it suits them.

The only people who will offer a referendum in a general election are the ones who have nothing to lose.

 

Spot on geo,lets honour the last referendum first before we even think about having another one.You are correct about runners-up,what have they got to lose by having another referendum,they might as well lose twice as once.Trouble is,it sets a precedent and General Elections will be the next target of disappointed voters who finish second.

I fear democracy in the UK is slowly dying.