Time for Norman Smurthwaite to put a genuine price tag on the club and go

[Mattholl]

Talking sense? Support Norman with his future gambles, because all of his others have been really productive. I can't believe what I'm reading. Wow.

 

Dont support him then, sit at home and keep your money in your pocket. Is going to games and slagging him off on the internet going to really force him out of the club? You cant do both in the real world

[robf]

Tim Barber said that everyone got it after the Sentinel story was published and was saying NS is lying.... as you confirm he wasnt. So does either party come out of that with any credit?

 

No, NS sent it to three fans including Jean and me before the Sentinel published. Jean then forwarded it to an email group which Tim was on after the Sentinel published.

[Mattholl]

Screengrab of email attached. I'm not if he wants his email address disclosed publicly so I have blanked that bit out.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]118[/ATTACH]

 

I never thought otherwise Rob... there are too many cooks spoiling the broth making accusations and turning the struggle into personal agendas of hate and sarcasm than fact. Someone like yourself should be the person to feed information to the fans groups, not 10-15 people on personal crusades. As much as NS looks a pillock the fans shouting their mouths off look equally if not more stupid because they are actually powerless other than to remove their 24 quid a game from his pocket.

[Family Stand Terrier]

Some fans need to understand that being a total a hole doesnt promote a nice easy sale process. If I want my next door neighbour to move because they are scum bags (true story) me slagging them off and making them look stupid all the time isnt going to get them to move, they own the house. Making sure the relationship is courteous and that if someone was to look at the house or consider buying it that we look hassle free neighbours and not a spanner in the works is the way to make it happen. Lets be honest is you looked at Port Vale and thought the fans have protested and got rid of Bill Bell, V2001 and then NS you probably look at it and think its not worth the effort when that is what you have to work with. If fans built a relationship that is professional and courteous with NS even if they think hes a total weapon the club looks like a decent prospect and they may well be included in the sale process as a sounding board should a genuine bidder emerge and open a dialogue. No bidder is going to want to do that for fear of ******* off NS currently

 

Dont support him then, sit at home and keep your money in your pocket. Is going to games and slagging him off on the internet going to really force him out of the club? You cant do both in the real world

 

I never thought otherwise Rob... there are too many cooks spoiling the broth making accusations and turning the struggle into personal agendas of hate and sarcasm than fact. Someone like yourself should be the person to feed information to the fans groups, not 10-15 people on personal crusades. As much as NS looks a pillock the fans shouting their mouths off look equally if not more stupid because they are actually powerless other than to remove their 24 quid a game from his pocket.

 

Matt, you're so way off the mark here it's scary. NS is followed by thousands on twitter, his words are published in papers, websites, forums etc. Are you suggesting that someone on OVF posting under pseudonym looks more stupid than the Chairman of a professional football club that; can't string a coherent sentence together, insults his customers, releases sensitive information about his workforce, lies regularly, etc etc. Do the people asking the questions represent Port Vale in an official capacity? Does Norman?

 

The analogy of someone selling their home is all well and good, but when one of the buyers is also a neighbour that dislikes the owner, and can see for themselves the damage he is causing to a property they love, the chances are it's not the other neighbours that they're going to look poorly on.

[JRC]

OVF never ceases to amaze me almost as much as the Norwegian hedge fund valuations. Realistically does anyone really think that NS is going to walk away from PVFC with a 2 million quid loss? Whilst everyone is calling on him to do this that and the other if I was him I wouldnt either. After all he owns the club and the ground and whilst its all very nice we talk about the love of the club, love of the club isnt worth a penny in the real world.

 

He stands to lose 2 million pounds regardless of what happens, realistically if he stops putting money into the club and calls in his loans he could actually put it into administration and in turn cut how much he is putting in to cover cost on a monthly basis. Or he could gamble that if he keeps rolling the dice for a few more seasons we might drop lucky with a player sale, playoff spot/ promotion to league 1 again or championship or investor willing to pay him a million less than what he says he wants. (halving his loss of 2 million).

 

Rather than ask a businessman to lose 2million quid fans would be more effective genuinely working with him to find a buyer and find out his valuations of the club and its assets. (however the later may put him at a negotiating disadvantage as bidders know what he personally values things at and might not launch an inflated offer)

 

Mate that's too much common sense for most fans on here. Port Vale is a bottomless pit which will drain the money from almost any investor. I give the next owner 3 years before the same people come up with the same set of complaints. We all had a real chance to invest in the club a few years ago and have a say and a financial stake. Most chose not to and spent their time complaining about people who fronted up their own money. I didn't agree with many things Bratt and co did, but I attended the agms and said my bit because I stumped up my own 5 grand which meant I had the right to. I don't agree with a lot Smurthwaite has done, but he's put a lot more real money in to the club than anyone else in the club's history.

 

I suspect he rues the day he ever let Paul Wildes talk him in to getting involved. I always thought his attempts to listen to fans would be doomed to failure as every fan has their own view, so in pleasing one you just annoy another. There is a very easy way for him to recoup a fair chunk of money - I'm sure Wimpey Homes could put an awful lot of houses on all that real estate.

[Family Stand Terrier]

There really is no point knocking some times. Smurf can go from mistake to mistake, disgracing the club, insulting fans (customers), racking up debt, splitting the club from the ground, acting unprofessionally, lying constantly, damaging the clubs reputation with players and managers, making enemies with local media, making enemies with agents, sharing sensitive information about his employees, releasing statements slagging everyone off, admitting that he's promoted ticket offers to people ALREADY IN THE GROUND!!!!...the list is endless.

 

And still, even after all of that, there are still people that go out of their way to support him. What does he have to do to the club for some people to wake up?

[Howjy04]

Talking sense? Support Norman with his future gambles, because all of his others have been really productive. I can't believe what I'm reading. Wow.

Seriously?Would you write off 3.7m because someone doesn't like you

and shouts it out loud.What will happen,will happen.He's aknowledged his **** ups.Hopefully there won't be any more.But it makes no sense for you to carry on this crusade when the outcome is something you can do very little about.Get over your spat FST,it ain't worth the grief you are giving yourself.

[Family Stand Terrier]

Seriously?Would you write off 3.7m because someone doesn't like you

and shouts it out loud.What will happen,will happen.He's aknowledged his **** ups.Hopefully there won't be any more.But it makes no sense for you to carry on this crusade when the outcome is something you can do very little about.Get over your spat FST,it ain't worth the grief you are giving yourself.

 

It's nothing to do with any spat, it's because I and many others can see the damage Norman is doing to the football club I love. He is causing serious damage, and is making us a laughing stock.

 

In answer to your question about writing off the debt. If I had the money Norman reportedly has, with the way I feel about Port Vale, and the clear evidence that every plan I've ever come up with has failed, yes, I'd write it off. If, as he keeps saying it is effecting his health, I'd probably decide that time spent with the only thing more important to me than Port Vale, my family, was more valuable than money.

 

However, I'd like to think that if I was in charge of the club, I'd have done a damn sight more to ensure that income was increased to bridge the gap, thus negating the need to pump £80k per month into the club. I certainly wouldn't base my plan for success on luck, that's for sure.

[cheshirevaliant]

it limits his liabilities massively though. Say we go down and hes having to fork out 100k a month to support the club. Rather than do that he can write off the money owed rather than add another 1.2 mill to it

 

He would just sell the club and keep the ground in that scenario, surely?

[SuperValiant1876]

It's nothing to do with any spat, it's because I and many others can see the damage Norman is doing to the football club I love. He is causing serious damage, and is making us a laughing stock.

 

In answer to your question about writing off the debt. If I had the money Norman reportedly has, with the way I feel about Port Vale, and the clear evidence that every plan I've ever come up with has failed, yes, I'd write it off. If, as he keeps saying it is effecting his health, I'd probably decide that time spent with the only thing more important to me than Port Vale, my family, was more valuable than money.

 

However, I'd like to think that if I was in charge of the club, I'd have done a damn sight more to ensure that income was increased to bridge the gap, thus negating the need to pump £80k per month into the club. I certainly wouldn't base my plan for success on luck, that's for sure.

 

Do you think the next owners won't have to pump any money in and if they do have to what would be an acceptable amount to you?

 

 

And of course you would write 3.7m off! And you argue Norm hasn't made sensible business decisions!!!

[Family Stand Terrier]

Do you think the next owners won't have to pump any money in and if they do have to what would be an acceptable amount to you?

 

 

And of course you would write 3.7m off! And you argue Norm hasn't made sensible business decisions!!!

I'd rather they raised income to run the club efficiently enough so as not to need to pump so much in.

 

Me writing off anything was a completely hypothetical question, which I answered firstly as a fan, secondly as a dream world lottery winner with more money than sense. I added the caveat that I'd rather not run up such a debt in the first place.

 

Sent from my D6603 using the onevalefan mobile app

[Mattholl]

It's nothing to do with any spat, it's because I and many others can see the damage Norman is doing to the football club I love. He is causing serious damage, and is making us a laughing stock.

 

In answer to your question about writing off the debt. If I had the money Norman reportedly has, with the way I feel about Port Vale, and the clear evidence that every plan I've ever come up with has failed, yes, I'd write it off. If, as he keeps saying it is effecting his health, I'd probably decide that time spent with the only thing more important to me than Port Vale, my family, was more valuable than money.

 

However, I'd like to think that if I was in charge of the club, I'd have done a damn sight more to ensure that income was increased to bridge the gap, thus negating the need to pump £80k per month into the club. I certainly wouldn't base my plan for success on luck, that's for sure.

 

One slight issue , NS doesnt have the same feeling about PVFC as you. your arguement falls down there straight away. Hes a businessman who invested large sums of money and isnt about to walk away 2 million light because you dont like him

[Mattholl]

I'd rather they raised income to run the club efficiently enough so as not to need to pump so much in.

 

Me writing off anything was a completely hypothetical question, which I answered firstly as a fan, secondly as a dream world lottery winner with more money than sense. I added the caveat that I'd rather not run up such a debt in the first place.

 

Sent from my D6603 using the onevalefan mobile app

 

you cant make money without spending money. If you want a larger marketing team and more visibility it costs money for wages and advertising, if you want a larger academy it costs money on staff, equipment,etc.. you cant run a football club like PVFC efficiently because the basic mechanics are theres not enough gate income to justify cost. Running PVFC with a budget depending on the gates would see us play lower league 2/ conference football. if thats what you want then youre a strange one mate

[Mattholl]

He would just sell the club and keep the ground in that scenario, surely?

 

maybe so but even that could be a major issue to NS as he doesnt have the infrastructure to run the stadium separate at the moment. He would need staff, safety people, maintenance teams etc.. the cost month on month would not be cheap to start from scratch would be difficult so he could out source to a leisure facility group but it would be dear

[Mattholl]

It's nothing to do with any spat, it's because I and many others can see the damage Norman is doing to the football club I love. He is causing serious damage, and is making us a laughing stock.

 

In answer to your question about writing off the debt. If I had the money Norman reportedly has, with the way I feel about Port Vale, and the clear evidence that every plan I've ever come up with has failed, yes, I'd write it off. If, as he keeps saying it is effecting his health, I'd probably decide that time spent with the only thing more important to me than Port Vale, my family, was more valuable than money.

 

However, I'd like to think that if I was in charge of the club, I'd have done a damn sight more to ensure that income was increased to bridge the gap, thus negating the need to pump £80k per month into the club. I certainly wouldn't base my plan for success on luck, that's for sure.

 

please explain how you would increase the income without spending and creating debt?