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Hunt wants to sneak another one through.


PVTony

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GMO foods are plentiful in the U.S. Gmo foods have been proven by research to cause tumours. Some states are fighting for the GMO foods to be labled so that they can be avoided, but are finding it difficult to get this done. 90% of the worlds corn and maize is GMO and farmers are buying it to feed cattle.

I will not purchase any food stuff that comes from U.S.

 

There six points of concern written in the website below, but my main worry is that the U.S. will flood the U.K. with the poisonous GMO foods.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/what-is-ttip-and-six-reasons-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

 

TTIP’s ‘regulatory convergence’ agenda will seek to bring EU standards on food safety and the environment closer to those of the US. But US regulations are much less strict, with 70 per cent of all processed foods sold in US supermarkets now containing genetically modified ingredients. By contrast, the EU allows virtually no GM foods. The US also has far laxer restrictions on the use of pesticides. It also uses growth hormones in its beef which are restricted in Europe due to links to cancer. US farmers have tried to have these restrictions lifted repeatedly in the past through the World Trade Organisation and it is likely that they will use TTIP to do so again.

 

The same goes for the environment, where the EU’s REACH regulations are far tougher on potentially toxic substances. In Europe a company has to prove a substance is safe before it can be used; in the US the opposite is true: any substance can be used until it is proven unsafe. As an example, the EU currently bans 1,200 substances from use in cosmetics; the US just 12.

 

But profits come first.....2nd,,,, 3rd with these people, and if a few million get cancer, they'll produce a drug that will keep them alive, not cure them mind, just keep them paying for a couple more years.

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When it dared to halt the production of a gold mine, the government of Romania found itself facing a massive lawsuit from a corporate mining giant in a secret "court". There's nothing about the case that makes any sense – the corporation has said it may seek up to $4 billion in "compensation", which is half of Romania’s annual public healthcare budget.

 

How awful for Romania to be subject to such a corporate assault, you may think. However, under a controversial trade deal between the UK and America known as TTIP, such cases could become common in Britain. So why is our government one of the biggest cheerleaders of these "corporate courts"?

What's happening in Romania is a terrifying sign of what could happen if TTIP is passed. The corporate vampires are out for blood, and won't rest until they've drained a sovereign state of its money, and destroyed large parts of its land. The mining giant Gabriel Resources originally wanted to develop an enormous gold mine that would involve flattening four mountain tops. There were fears that this would would leave behind a behind a toxic waste lake containing dammed water and cyanide. But in 2014 a critical environmental document that was required for the project to go-ahead was annulled in a Romanian court. In the face of mass protests inside and outside the country, Romania’s parliament decided not to push through a law that would have allowed the project to continue.

 

Gabriel Resources has recently admitted that they've lost hope of ever building their mine. But at the same time they submitted a request for arbitration at the World Bank, demanding compensation for all the gold and silver that they were unable to extract. The company is using a Jersey subsidiary to bring the case, so it can make use of a UK-Romania investment deal, even though it's based in Canada. The company claims they have spent nearly $500 million on the project, yet in an interview the company’s CEO claimed he was seeking up to $4 billion in "compensation".

 

This is exactly the kind of case which that TTIP would promote throughout Europe. Through something called the Investor-State Dispute Settlement (ISDS) mechanism, foreign corporations get access to a secret arbitration system to sue governments for "damaging" their profits. These cases are taking place with an alarming frequency using a variety of existing trade deals, but TTIP would massively expand the possibility of this taking place. It would do this by allowing all US corporations to sue EU member states and all EU corporations to sue the US government.

 

The role corporate courts will play if TTIP is introduced has proven to be the most controversial aspect of the deal. Ninety-seven per cent of respondents to an EU consultation rejected the idea, while the EU parliament descended into farce when passing its opinion on TTIP in June, as the parliament’s president threw out the rule book to prevent a critical vote on the ISDS system. So toxic is TTIP, that the European Commission is considering rebranding ISDS as Investment Court Settlement as a means of undercutting the backlash.

 

Yet despite all of this, the British government is fully signed up to the corporate courts. Last year it signed a letter that made clear that the secret court system shouldn’t be removed from the trade deal under any circumstances.

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TTIP: France threatens to walk away from negotiations

 

 

MarvinTheAndroid

Cameron and his tory mates wholeheartedly support singing TTIP which is very clearly undermining democracy and it's impact on trade have been shown by a number report, including EU commission report, the the benefits on trade are predicted to be up to 0.5% of GDP over 10 years, ie to low to be detected. EU report also takes about substantial job losses.

Cameron and torys wants a referendum on EU membership because torys have campaigned that it undermines democracy and cost money. Yet torys and cameron are highly pro ttip which definatly will undermine democracy even more and will cost millions of jobs. Why does he want ttip ? Becasuse tory want to be able to make backroom deal in ISDS tribunals wit out any public scrutiny.

The top members of the torys are by definition traitors and we should open wing for them in one of the nastier sections of Broadmoor prison as the tower is big enough to hold them all ..

 

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+2

61 days ago

sbkenn

Why is it only France that is threatening to scupper this deal ? It is undemocratic in the extreme. None of our governments should have even considered it. There ARE NO guarantees for commercial operations, and the citizens are the only ones who should matter, no one more that any other. Secret deals, secret courts, suing countries for changes in policy which benefit the people ... all are illegal, and IMO, treasonous.

 

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+2

65 days ago

Dryden Cooper

The whole TTIP treaty is like the E.U. not open to democratic scrutiny.The system is topsy turvy for a start ,a Commission then council of ministers they enact laws.The only elected bit the parliament can amend or vote down but cannot propose legislation.

 

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+4

66 days ago

Doc

Lack of transparency?

There's no transparency at all!

This is a stitch-up by Big Corporations to run the governments of Europe.

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Why are China produced US brands more expensive here? Are not services the main target? Their health costs are more expensive than ours. My experience of the US is that making money for themselves is the purpose of TTIP as with the Pacific version. Why is it all being done in secret?

 

China products more expensive here than in the uS? Cos our market is prepared/can afford to pay more?

 

Which health costs..is there a direct comparison available?

 

Businesses (as in Ltd cos. and PLCs ) exist to make money for their owners... of course they think TTIP will be good for business.....If it is it it's good for those employees of UK busineses too that take advantage..why does it have to be "good for business =- bad for UK workers"?

 

If it's all being done in secret how come we on here know so much about it? So much that some can categorically say it's a bad thing??

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GMO foods are plentiful in the U.S. Gmo foods have been proven by research to cause tumours. Some states are fighting for the GMO foods to be labled so that they can be avoided, but are finding it difficult to get this done. 90% of the worlds corn and maize is GMO and farmers are buying it to feed cattle.

I will not purchase any food stuff that comes from U.S.

 

There six points of concern written in the website below, but my main worry is that the U.S. will flood the U.K. with the poisonous GMO foods.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/what-is-ttip-and-six-reasons-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

 

TTIP’s ‘regulatory convergence’ agenda will seek to bring EU standards on food safety and the environment closer to those of the US. But US regulations are much less strict, with 70 per cent of all processed foods sold in US supermarkets now containing genetically modified ingredients. By contrast, the EU allows virtually no GM foods. The US also has far laxer restrictions on the use of pesticides. It also uses growth hormones in its beef which are restricted in Europe due to links to cancer. US farmers have tried to have these restrictions lifted repeatedly in the past through the World Trade Organisation and it is likely that they will use TTIP to do so again.

 

The same goes for the environment, where the EU’s REACH regulations are far tougher on potentially toxic substances. In Europe a company has to prove a substance is safe before it can be used; in the US the opposite is true: any substance can be used until it is proven unsafe. As an example, the EU currently bans 1,200 substances from use in cosmetics; the US just 12.

 

So do we KNOW that EU regulations will be (my words) "lightened" to allow all of this or do you fear that they will be? I see no roof In the link provided..all seems spectacularly biased and "unscientific"..but happy to be corrected

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So do we KNOW that EU regulations will be (my words) "lightened" to allow all of this or do you fear that they will be? I see no roof In the link provided..all seems spectacularly biased and "unscientific"..but happy to be corrected

 

'WE', well I can only speak for myself, I do not know, but I do not fear that regulations will be lightened. Although any country that goes ahead with this TTIP deal will have to make some/many consessions to align with U.S. regulations.

 

Some leaders of countries may go ahead, but U.S. puppet Cameron will most likely toe the line.

Countries leaders that put people first, (Putin has banned ALL GMO food) will reject the deal.

Interestingly though, the sensible J. Corbyn is not in favour of TTIP.

 

http://jeremycorbyn.org.uk/articles/question-on-ttip/

 

Jeremy Corbyn: I commend my hon. Friend the Member for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) for securing this debate. It is long overdue, so well done to him for pressing for it. I also want to thank all the campaigning groups.

“TTIP is being agreed by a European institution which was not democratically elected”.

 

I conclude by asking why there is secrecy surrounding the negotiations. Is it because there are ante-rooms on either side of the Atlantic stuffed full of highly effective corporate lobbyists doing their best to develop their own interests? Should we not instead be demanding a free trade agreement that narrows the gap between the rich and the poor, that protects the advance of public services such as the national health service, that fundamentally protects food production, and that ensures that the best standards become the universal standards, rather than engaging in a race to the bottom that results in the worst standards becoming the norm on both sides of the Atlantic? I hope that the House will reject TTIP.

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'WE', well I can only speak for myself, I do not know, but I do not fear that regulations will be lightened.

 

I am pretty sure that some will too..but that will swing both ways surely? Lihtr regulation dos not have to men things get worse and in some cases standards will go up and some EU products banned in the US will become "legal" there.Big business does not always mean bad business

 

Although any country that goes ahead with this TTIP deal will have to make some/many consessions to align with U.S. regulations.

 

As will the US regarding the EU

 

Some leaders of countries may go ahead, but U.S. puppet Cameron will most likely toe the line.

Countries leaders that put people first, (Putin has banned ALL GMO food) will reject the deal.

 

It's never that black and white..how is (for example) opening uS markets to UK business(and their employees) not putting people first? How is preventing UK working people form having access to safe cheaper US products and services putting people first?

 

Interestingly though, the sensible J. Corbyn is not in favour of TTIP.

 

There is another J. Corbyn? Cos I only know of the one who isn't sensible..the current leader of the Labour party ;)

 

Many believe TTIP will achieve all he wants. What's his exact proposal/alternative? His remarks as usual lack any substance..just a wish list

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I am pretty sure that some will too..but that will swing both ways surely? Lihtr regulation dos not have to men things get worse and in some cases standards will go up and some EU products banned in the US will become "legal" there.Big business does not always mean bad business

 

 

 

As will the US regarding the EU

 

It's never that black and white..how is (for example) opening uS markets to UK business(and their employees) not putting people first? How is preventing UK working people form having access to safe cheaper US products and services putting people first?

 

 

 

There is another J. Corbyn? Cos I only know of the one who isn't sensible..the current leader of the Labour party ;)

 

Many believe TTIP will achieve all he wants. What's his exact proposal/alternative? His remarks as usual lack any substance..just a wish list

Big Business' only consider maximum profit for share holders and not benefits to populations.

 

Regarding J.Corbyn. I have not voted for Labour for more than 25 years and not voted Tory since M. Thatcher so MY opinion bears no bias. Some tory supporters will never have a good word for a Labour party leader.

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Big Business' only consider maximum profit for share holders and not benefits to populations.

 

Which is great for the small share holders (tens of millions of them), little old ladies who rely on income from such investments, individuals pension funds (millions of them), and so on. Which organisations (you know, the ones that generate wealth and jobs) do consider 'benefits to populations'? Other then benefitting populations by generating wealth, providing jobs and so on?

 

 

Regarding J.Corbyn. I have not voted for Labour for more than 25 years and not voted Tory since M. Thatcher so MY opinion bears no bias. Some tory supporters will never have a good word for a Labour party leader.

 

I've not claimed that you are biased..some people though are just anti-big business despite all the benefits they bring

 

Re Labour leaders...very true..I'm not one of them having on here praised everyone from Foot to Smith

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Which is great for the small share holders (tens of millions of them), little old ladies who rely on income from such investments, individuals pension funds (millions of them), and so on. Which organisations (you know, the ones that generate wealth and jobs) do consider 'benefits to populations'? Other then benefitting populations by generating wealth, providing jobs and so on?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know, and I suggest that you don't know either if U.S. Mega corpoations have tens of millions of U.K. small share holders, or indeed if U.K. big businesses have presently tens of millions of small share holders. If you do know this, in your own words, from which source?

 

Do really think that the small businesses will benefit in some way. I don't. The ones that are struggling will go 'bump' and the small successful ones will most likely be bought out.

 

The mega, mega, corporations are reported to be holdng secret meetings to maximise their profits in any TTIP deals. Small share holders will not be included in these proposed deals and small share holders will not be considered. In fact I believe that small share holders will not be welcome because the greedy corporations want ALL the profits.

 

Millions of people across Europe ( more than three and a half million) have already signed the petition and some countries in Europe are considering to scrap the TTIP, especially France ( as posted yesterday). I have read that the SNP are dead set against it.

 

The shady secret dealings will eventually have to come before te U.K parliment and I hope that their are enough honest M.P's to vote against any proposed deal.

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I don't know, and I suggest that you don't know either if U.S. Mega corpoations have tens of millions of U.K. small share holders, or indeed if U.K. big businesses have presently tens of millions of small share holders. If you do know this, in your own words, from which source?

 

The vast majority of pension funds, ISAs etc will give a breakdown of sectors they invested in and even go down to the level of the individual companies..including US mega corporations..Virgin money ISAs for example

 

Do really think that the small businesses will benefit in some way. I don't. The ones that are struggling will go 'bump' and the small successful ones will most likely be bought out.

 

I do..for example the many small businesses that support the larger businesses will have increased demand for their services if the larger businesses grow and employ more people as a result..everyone form cleaning companies to sandwich shops to retailers and 1000s more..then the new employees of the large organiations wll buy cars, furntiture. electric goods, more food etc

 

The mega, mega, corporations are reported to be holdng secret meetings to maximise their profits in any TTIP deals. Small share holders will not be included in these proposed deals and small share holders will not be considered. In fact I believe that small share holders will not be welcome because the greedy corporations want ALL the profits.

 

And who profits get paid to? Shareholders!!Pension fund companies are amongst the biggest share holders in mega corporations and profits get returned to the pension fund via dividends (for example) and so the 'little man' gets some of the profit. How do you think a pension fund generates money if not thru such activity?

 

Millions of people across Europe ( more than three and a half million) have already signed the petition and some countries in Europe are considering to scrap the TTIP, especially France ( as posted yesterday). I have read that the SNP are dead set against it.

 

Of course there are millions against it..some people will inevitably lose out, some inevitably fear change, some of their fears may be valid

 

The shady secret dealings will eventually have to come before te U.K parliment and I hope that their are enough honest M.P's to vote against any proposed deal.

 

I hope they scrutinise the deal fully and make a correct judgement as to whether it's in our best interest or not.either way

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I don't think that the replies/answers that you have given throughout these many messages will convince OVF members that TTIP would be good for the general public and certainly not convincing for the three and half million who have already signed the petition against it.

 

There are plenty more websites that write negatively about TTIP and we could could continue, you and I with many more replies/messages.

 

I know that you like to have the last say in such debates so this will be my last message on the subject and await your finalreply.

Thanks for 'entertainment' Johnny.

(I think that you would make a very good politician) :yes:

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I don't think that the replies/answers that you have given throughout these many messages will convince OVF members that TTIP would be good for the general public and certainly not convincing for the three and half million who have already signed the petition against it.

 

I am not trying to convince OVF members that TTIP would be good for the general public and I'm sure that most of the 3 and a half million will not see my posts. I simply point out that there is more to this than what you post and hope people will, if they wish to, get to know more about it and make their mind up

 

There are plenty more websites that write negatively about TTIP and we could could continue, you and I with many more replies/messages.

 

There are plenty more websites that write positively about TTIP and indeed we could

 

I know that you like to have the last say in such debates so this will be my last message on the subject and await your finalreply.

Thanks for 'entertainment' Johnny.

(I think that you would make a very good politician) :yes:

 

I can never decide to have the last say, that's up to others who let me have the last say (or not)

 

I appreciate the compliment ;)

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TTIP is not scrutinised and opposed because of it's Business values. It is scrutinised because of it's threat to democracy. If corporations get to make our laws then we are in trouble. Big Trouble.

 

It would mean a normal person's consumer rights would potentially be eradicated...along with many workers rights and small business would never get to expand because the laws that big corporations make would not allow it.

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Big Business' only consider maximum profit for share holders and not benefits to populations.

 

Regarding J.Corbyn. I have not voted for Labour for more than 25 years and not voted Tory since M. Thatcher so MY opinion bears no bias. Some tory supporters will never have a good word for a Labour party leader.

 

Some Labour leaning people will never concede the good things that Thatcher did for this country!

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TTIP is not scrutinised and opposed because of it's Business values. It is scrutinised because of it's threat to democracy. If corporations get to make our laws then we are in trouble. Big Trouble.

 

Parliaments and the like make laws and courts enforce them...corporations don't make laws and don't enforce them..they would still have to win their cases in court

 

It would mean a normal person's consumer rights would potentially be eradicated

 

How? Which consumer rights?

 

...along with many workers rights

 

How? Which?

 

and small business would never get to expand because the laws that big corporations make would not allow it.

 

How? Which types of small business?

 

Basically can you put some flesh on the bones of those claims?

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