Embarrassment.

[Heatwave]

Cheers. There are decent humans still then that support Vale. I only want to air any possibilities of away games being attended by me and others that share my views, without being subjected to sitting by or near Neanderthals!

 

Thank you. I wished I could have cadged a lift off you; you could have dropped me off at Coven.

[B&W Blood]

Why there was no netting on the first few rows and sticking out from the ad boards on the Steve Bull upper tier like at Sheff Utd to prevent missiles being thrown at away fans below, and how the ground safety certificate was approved in the face of this glaring potential problem I'll never know.[/QUOTE]

 

This is something that really does need asking and answered by the Club itself/safer officer,Police and who ever issues the Safety certificate.

 

It would be a very very simple solution,it is used in many places.It could save the club a lot of trouble and money.

[AlienTitWrench]

Who were the two Vale fans fighting with each other during the second half and what was it about?

 

One of the lads escaped to the front of the stand and was escorted along the running track by stewards before he got his head kicked in by some massive psycho looking Vale Fan. Bunch of idiots!

[Mellor!]

Really I'm with Onestep on this one.

 

At VP, if I wanted to sit with the nutters I'd go in the Paddock. As it is I go in the Lorne Street because I prefer not to be mixed up and be associated with some of the types that sit(?) in the Railway, Hamil side. As I see it all that Onestep is asking for is the opportunity to do the same at away games.

 

Not sanctimonious at all actually. I wouldn't mind it myself.

 

It's not where he wants to sit, it's how he puts it across.

 

At most away games the away end isn't even half full. I like to stand, sing and let some steam off at away games, so I usually stand at the back out of anyones way. If people want to sit and watch the game quietly, then there is usually ample space to move to somewhere suitable. However 2/3 games a season we fill an away end and after each of those games we get a thread like this. I don't know what people want? Who is classed as a proper fan and who is scum? I don't wear colours, I stand up all game, I swear, I have a drink before the game, I call the ref a ****er, I sometimes even call the opposing fans ****ers :rolleyes:. I class this as normal football fan behaviour, onestepatatime would probably say as I was sub-human scum. So what do we do about it? Am I part of the problem? Should the ground just be full of people sitting on their hands? Life is full of different people and characters, so obviously a football ground is going to be a mixture of those people. If people have been violent, racist, homophobic, etc,... Then they should be banned. Not many people will disagree with that. It's just the holier than thou attitude that some fans have that really gets to me.

[valiant_593]

I hope you do get your 'I'm a better fan/person than you are' block tickets sorted, because I have no desire to stand/sit with sanctimonious ***** such as yourself.

 

Who the **** do you think you are?

 

What? Im with Onestep as well, why the hell should we, vale fans have to sit with the cretins who ruined the wolves match? Nobody is saying they are better than anyone, its just given a choice id much rather sit by people who are going to watch and enjoy the game and actually support the vale rather than sit by those who are there to fight.

[valiant_593]

It's not where he wants to sit, it's how he puts it across.

 

At most away games the away end isn't even half full. I like to stand, sing and let some steam off at away games, so I usually stand at the back out of anyones way. If people want to sit and watch the game quietly, then there is usually ample space to move to somewhere suitable. However 2/3 games a season we fill an away end and after each of those games we get a thread like this. I don't know what people want? Who is classed as a proper fan and who is scum? I don't wear colours, I stand up all game, I swear, I have a drink before the game, I call the ref a ****er, I sometimes even call the opposing fans ****ers :rolleyes:. I class this as normal football fan behaviour, onestepatatime would probably say as I was sub-human scum. So what do we do about it? Am I part of the problem? Should the ground just be full of people sitting on their hands? Life is full of different people and characters, so obviously a football ground is going to be a mixture of those people. If people have been violent, racist, homophobic, etc,... Then they should be banned. Not many people will disagree with that. It's just the holier than thou attitude that some fans have that really gets to me.

 

No yours is passion, scum is those who turn up with one intention, to fight. I dont mind anyone swearing at the ref, like you say, its those like on saturday who spent all match trying to start fights and not even watching the game. Scum are those that were spitting and threatening others especially in front of young kids. The point is in these 2/3 games (been more than usual this season) we shouldnt have to threads like this as the behaviour shouldnt be so bad. Im all for people showing passion, having a pint, swearing, they are normal fans, its those few (number seems to be growing) that just ruin the day.

[JOHNNYAITCH]

I wasn't there..seems some Vale fans caused trouble and some Wolves fans caused trouble, some Vale fans responded to what Wolves fans started and some Wolves fans responded to what Vale fans started. Fans who started trouble are idiots, some fans who responded are idiots..the vast majority of fasn are not idiots

 

Police and stewards have a responsibility to protect the innocent and to apprehend and control the guilty, and they seem in many cases to have failed

 

Do we have more than our fair share of idiots? I have no idea

 

The solution..deterrent is the only way to stop the idiots and protect and encourage everyone else to attend. Lifelong bans form all stadiums, report to police stations during matches for life (home and away), herd them into a field during matches..yes you have to be caught for these to actually happen but the deterrent migt just discourage them and free up the stadiums for everyone else.

 

It's the police and stewards failing to protect the innocent that gets me

[Robbie Earle's Perm]

It's not where he wants to sit, it's how he puts it across.

 

At most away games the away end isn't even half full. I like to stand, sing and let some steam off at away games, so I usually stand at the back out of anyones way. If people want to sit and watch the game quietly, then there is usually ample space to move to somewhere suitable. However 2/3 games a season we fill an away end and after each of those games we get a thread like this. I don't know what people want? Who is classed as a proper fan and who is scum? I don't wear colours, I stand up all game, I swear, I have a drink before the game, I call the ref a ****er, I sometimes even call the opposing fans ****ers :rolleyes:. I class this as normal football fan behaviour, onestepatatime would probably say as I was sub-human scum. So what do we do about it? Am I part of the problem? Should the ground just be full of people sitting on their hands? Life is full of different people and characters, so obviously a football ground is going to be a mixture of those people. If people have been violent, racist, homophobic, etc,... Then they should be banned. Not many people will disagree with that. It's just the holier than thou attitude that some fans have that really gets to me.

 

I think you have misjudged Onestepatatime completely and that's a shame speaking as someone who had the pleasure of meeting him on a personal basis before I knew of his contributions on this message board. Anyone that met him would instantly warm to him as he is a pleasant, chatty and seemingly well educated human being.

 

He isn't judging your choice, if you want to be near people who act aggressively towards others, threaten them, throw things at others, contravene the law of the land that's your choice, he simply doesn't and his suggestion is an alternative to the one I outlined earlier to avoid decent people having to be associated with this mindless scum that is blighting our club.

 

What you outline you do is fine by me, I would do dome things, I wouldn't do others but as they are within the laws of the land they are our respective choices.

 

Attempting to belittle a decent human being who is simply trying to suggest a reasonable way to avoid these thugs is wrong however and I am sure if like me you ever had the pleasure of Onestepatatime's company you would recognise this. Taken as an example it's normal for criminals, which is what a lot of these people he is referring to are, to be separated from decent people in society with things like prisons, neither Onestepatatime, you or I as law obiding citizens would want to spend time with people like this in such an institution would we?

[Row L]

Sort of post that really confirms to me that people want to believe nowt is wrong and the idiot section of crowds isn't ruining the enjoyment for others.

 

You have been mighty lucky mate not to have been caught up in any nonsense/violence or disgusting behaviour by either our own or opponents fans.

 

I have followed Vale for over 30 years and believe me it's getting far worse now than ever to attend away games with scum that pretend to pass off as Vale supporters. It has taken me many years to try and coax my missus to have a season ticket for my beloved club and for her to enjoy away days but sadly, as I've stated previously I do not want her to be subjected to the kind of day we had Saturday ever again. If that makes me a coward or a person who is making a fuss in your eyes, so be it.

 

Your last paragraph is interesting...that is all we want to do, enjoy the game and have fun in a legal, sensible way. Do you condone and accept the wrong doings of others and their infantile, aggressive, illegal, threatening behaviour? If so sorry but I am not wishing to be called a Vale fan alongside you!

 

I think that you need a re-read and to check what I have said. I saw nothing thrown – FACT. But I did see plenty of Vale ‘fans’ acting in an aggressive and belligerent way which was totally unnecessary.

 

I know that there is trouble at games, I know where I can find it, how to start it and in many cases how to end it without getting hurt. That doesn’t make me hard or clever, just a statement of fact. The point that I was making is that I choose not to get involved, choose to have a laugh and banter with home fans and choose to act like a decent human being representing myself, my family, my club and city in a way that I feel they should be represented.

 

The problem with Vale away fans being deliberately difficult with each other, opposing fans, steward and police is getting worse and needs to be sorted in my book. I have actually chosen not to go to some away games in the past when I thought that my son would be frightened and that I wouldn’t be able to protect him and my elderly father if necessary.

 

To summarise – you can find and you can avoid trouble if you need to. It would be nice if you didn’t have to though! It SHOULD be very easy to watch a game without worry about some know trying to fight you and the sooner that all teams get rid of people (including many who were at the Wolves game) who have this kind of attitude the better.

 

And for reference, my last paragraph was aimed at ALL fans and a reminder that we are ALL there to enjoy the game. It wasn’t aimed at Vale, Wolves or any other kind of fan. Just asking everyone to chill out at away games and think about what they are doing. We all have to get along and calling each other ****ers, throwing things and banging on windows isn’t the way to go about it IMO.

[Bert Llewellyn]

Any of us who were there only saw a small fraction of what was going on. Both sets of supporters certainly contained a minority who are complete and utter morons - I don't think anyone can argue with that. The police from my experience did a reasonable job but why there were no or very few police between where we were escorted on to the ring road and to where we turned off to the station was beyond me. I was walking up the opposite side of the road to the majority of vale fans as I was off to meet some Wolves supporting friends for a drink. This gave me plenty of opportunity to hear the wolves fans planning to attack the vale fans and a first class view of vale fans running across the road to get at the wolves fans.

 

There were elements amongst both sets of fans who were clearly there for trouble after the match. Inside the ground it was a hostile atmosphere with lots of the usual bile coming from some of our so called fans. I didn't see anything thrown but that is not to say it didn't happen as some very reasonable supporters have stated on here and I have no reason to disbelieve them.

 

What Wolves choose to do about there fans is up to them but I wish to God that we didn't attract those amongst our away support who are hell bent on causing as much trouble as possible.

[Jacko51]

Any of us who were there only saw a small fraction of what was going on. Both sets of supporters certainly contained a minority who are complete and utter morons - I don't think anyone can argue with that. The police from my experience did a reasonable job but why there were no or very few police between where we were escorted on to the ring road and to where we turned off to the station was beyond me. I was walking up the opposite side of the road to the majority of vale fans as I was off to meet some Wolves supporting friends for a drink. This gave me plenty of opportunity to hear the wolves fans planning to attack the vale fans and a first class view of vale fans running across the road to get at the wolves fans.

 

There were elements amongst both sets of fans who were clearly there for trouble after the match. Inside the ground it was a hostile atmosphere with lots of the usual bile coming from some of our so called fans. I didn't see anything thrown but that is not to say it didn't happen as some very reasonable supporters have stated on here and I have no reason to disbelieve them.

 

What Wolves choose to do about there fans is up to them but I wish to God that we didn't attract those amongst our away support who are hell bent on causing as much trouble as possible.

 

Well said, Bert.

[Vital Spark]

I personally didn't see anything thrown from above us in the JL8 section, but I did see plenty of Vale fans acting like complete morons in the concourse and in the seats. But what was most disappointing was the stewards reluctance to uphold any kind of order. There were people standing up all through the game, there were people drinking bottles of beer in the stand, there were people in the wrong seats, there were people in the gangways througout the game, the were people being extremely abusive, the were people being racist etc.. etc.. But the stewards chose to do nothing.

[Santa]

Any of us who were there only saw a small fraction of what was going on. Both sets of supporters certainly contained a minority who are complete and utter morons - I don't think anyone can argue with that. The police from my experience did a reasonable job but why there were no or very few police between where we were escorted on to the ring road and to where we turned off to the station was beyond me. I was walking up the opposite side of the road to the majority of vale fans as I was off to meet some Wolves supporting friends for a drink. This gave me plenty of opportunity to hear the wolves fans planning to attack the vale fans and a first class view of vale fans running across the road to get at the wolves fans.

 

There were elements amongst both sets of fans who were clearly there for trouble after the match. Inside the ground it was a hostile atmosphere with lots of the usual bile coming from some of our so called fans. I didn't see anything thrown but that is not to say it didn't happen as some very reasonable supporters have stated on here and I have no reason to disbelieve them.

 

What Wolves choose to do about there fans is up to them but I wish to God that we didn't attract those amongst our away support who are hell bent on causing as much trouble as possible.

I wouldn't disagree with any of that. It seems strange that having taken the trouble to filter both sets of supporters out of the ground under close supervision, as soon as we got on to the dual carriageway (Stafford Street?) they were left to fend for themselves and were allowed very easily to meet head on.

[onestepatatime]

I think that you need a re-read and to check what I have said. I saw nothing thrown – FACT. But I did see plenty of Vale ‘fans’ acting in an aggressive and belligerent way which was totally unnecessary.

 

I know that there is trouble at games, I know where I can find it, how to start it and in many cases how to end it without getting hurt. That doesn’t make me hard or clever, just a statement of fact. The point that I was making is that I choose not to get involved, choose to have a laugh and banter with home fans and choose to act like a decent human being representing myself, my family, my club and city in a way that I feel they should be represented.

 

The problem with Vale away fans being deliberately difficult with each other, opposing fans, steward and police is getting worse and needs to be sorted in my book. I have actually chosen not to go to some away games in the past when I thought that my son would be frightened and that I wouldn’t be able to protect him and my elderly father if necessary.

 

To summarise – you can find and you can avoid trouble if you need to. It would be nice if you didn’t have to though! It SHOULD be very easy to watch a game without worry about some know trying to fight you and the sooner that all teams get rid of people (including many who were at the Wolves game) who have this kind of attitude the better.

 

And for reference, my last paragraph was aimed at ALL fans and a reminder that we are ALL there to enjoy the game. It wasn’t aimed at Vale, Wolves or any other kind of fan. Just asking everyone to chill out at away games and think about what they are doing. We all have to get along and calling each other ****ers, throwing things and banging on windows isn’t the way to go about it IMO.

 

Thanks for the clarification Row L.

 

I am old enough and wise enough to know most times when and where trouble is brewing and have over 30 plus years seen many acts of violence at football matches. Like you I try and use my knowledge and nous to avoid such events. What I resent and am trying to say on my posts is that why should "ordinary, law abiding fans" have to sit by or near to scum and bile who simply use these matches as a tool to get drunk/drugged up and want to fight anything that moves?

I am not a person who tries to talk down to anyone, I am just looking at possible ways that fans like me and my missus and thousands of other fantastic people who follow Vale can sit in peace and support our team.

 

I do shout, I do swear(at Vale, refs and opponents players) from time to time, BUT I do it in a way that is honestly acceptable for reasonable human beings acting at any football match. I don't ask that fans sit on their hands or happy clap or try and enjoy the day but I draw the line at so called Vale fans who attend away games who have no regard for anyone around them, who are out to start trouble, who are looking for a fight with anyone. You know that there are hundreds of them now appearing at every away game. Saturday was horrible. Certain people were only there to cause trouble, they actually didn't watch the match and most of them probably didn't know what the score was at any given time.

 

I can look after myself but my missus, kids, dads and women sat near to us (every away game where there is a huge Vale contingent) are vulnerable and to witness kids crying and women being frightened for their health at a football match is abhorrent to say the least.

 

The reaction to some on here to my genuine post is alarming. I have not accused any poster of being involved in the nonsense that occurred at Wolves. I have not tried to be clever. I have not wished to be seen as a do gooder. I simply want to get more people like me to try and see if we can actually find a solution to the hooliganism that is ruining the game and is harming Port Vale.

 

I agree that when there is a smallish crowd at away games the trouble appears to be almost non existent and everyone can enjoy their day. I was at Plymouth recently and the other 130 fans had a great time, without any nonsense or trouble(except for a 2 minute rant by Adams at a fan who apparently had upset him)! However it is obvious that when we have a sell out or near as damn it away we have to endure sitting in seats allocated and that usually means some morons are very close by trying to look "hard" in gangs and inciting trouble.

 

ALL I ask is if there is anything that can be done to allow people like me etc to sit in areas that cannot be infiltrated by the moronic mob that somehow purchase tickets to these games. Is that reason to abuse me on this thread? Is that reason to query my thoughts?

 

Cheers REP for what you have posted. I know there are those on here who instantly dislike anything you state but I have had the pleasure of meeting you away from Vale and know that you, too are an upstanding, decent , true Vale fan who simply wants the best for Vale and your self and mates.

 

Wow! I seem to have started something inadvertently as all I wanted to achieve was like minded fans pondering if they could come up with any ideas to combat the disease that is rife in Football and most certainly rears it's ugly head at Vale away games.

 

Anyone who seriously wants to question that is not on the same wave length as me and I do wonder if my years of supporting Vale have eaten away my grey cells?

[smithie]

I wouldn't disagree with any of that. It seems strange that having taken the trouble to filter both sets of supporters out of the ground under close supervision, as soon as we got on to the dual carriageway (Stafford Street?) they were left to fend for themselves and were allowed very easily to meet head on.

 

To be fair to West Midlands Police they have actually adopted a softer attitude at football matches, with the option of going in hard if needed. I don't think many would disagree with that as a policy.

 

Also, there is only so much you can do in a layout like Wolverhampton. There are roads leading in all directions, underpasses, shops, car parks nearby and it is nigh-on impossible to cover it all. Like most big games, it is an exercise in damage limitation. I hope no-one came away too badly from it.

 

I saw two Wolves yobs (who were mouthing off) get a few slaps, but it really was handbags stuff. Considering there were 5 Vale "fans" involved, it was pretty tame stuff which just showed how much bluster it really all is!

 

I was surprised to see more than a few Vale fans in colours, and without those it's much easier to avoid confrontation.